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Post by Deleted on Nov 18, 2019 14:51:06 GMT
That jive was poor. It's uncomfortable watching Kelvin dance. It's like watching your dad dance at a wedding. There was very little complex choreography. You clearly know nothing about Latin jive if you think the dancing was poor and the choreography basic (although the inclusion of some basic steps is funnily enough actually a good thing so it isn't surprising there were a few American spins etc). And a lower centre of gravity for jive isn't really a bad thing - the knees should for the most part be flexed. Search for Neil & Katya Jones doing a competition jive on YouTube and you'll see. I agree with you entirely that his arms need work, but unfortunately your sweeping statements about the rest seem to suggest a deep dislike for him rather than any truthful comment on technique. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 18, 2019 15:02:49 GMT
That jive was poor. It's uncomfortable watching Kelvin dance. It's like watching your dad dance at a wedding. There was very little complex choreography. You clearly know nothing about Latin jive if you think the dancing was poor and the choreography basic (although the inclusion of some basic steps is funnily enough actually a good thing so it isn't surprising there were a few American spins etc). And a lower centre of gravity for jive isn't really a bad thing - the knees should for the most part be flexed. Search for Neil & Katya Jones doing a competition jive on YouTube and you'll see. I agree with you entirely that his arms need work, but unfortunately your sweeping statements about the rest seem to suggest a deep dislike for him rather than any truthful comment on technique. Thank you for your response. I feel you have made a mountain out of a molehill here. Let's agree to disagree. I could break down every dance but I'm not going to. Saffron is technically below average, disagree that's fine. You can be a ballroom dancer and still be incorrect. That's like saying well I'm Boris Johnson, so I know everything about politics. A lower centre of gravity is fine, I didn't talk about a lower centre of gravity, I said he is hunched in every dance. Different. I don't appreciate you being so harsh with your tone but you're passionate. Lets just move past this... |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 18, 2019 15:57:28 GMT
I feel you have made a mountain out of a molehill here. Let's agree to disagree. I could break down every dance but I'm not going to. Saffron is technically below average, disagree that's fine. You can be a ballroom dancer and still be incorrect. That's like saying well I'm Boris Johnson, so I know everything about politics. A lower centre of gravity is fine, I didn't talk about a lower centre of gravity, I said he is hunched in every dance. Different. I don't appreciate you being so harsh with your tone but you're passionate. Lets just move past this... I'm afraid I can't quite move past this yet, because you still seem to be confusing fact and opinion (which is why your analogy to politics doesn't work in the slightest). Technical correctness in dance is a matter of fact, not opinion. Whether a step is danced on a heel lead or toe first is a matter of fact - for each different step, one is correct and the other is not - there are books on the subject of technique that everyone follows. That is the case regardless of what you think of a dancer's STYLE, which is the wholly subjective element. Dancers are judged on both, on Strictly and everywhere else. Therefore a statement that Saffron is technically below average is just factually incorrect. A statement that you personally find her to be a below average dancer overall is not, as that is your opinion. If you accept that you are not trying to state facts but rather commenting on her dance style, then we can agree to disagree. And on the centre of gravity point, I know you said hunched, I didnt dsagree with that, I was just trying to explain what the reason for that hunched appearance might have been. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 18, 2019 16:06:31 GMT
I feel you have made a mountain out of a molehill here. Let's agree to disagree. I could break down every dance but I'm not going to. Saffron is technically below average, disagree that's fine. You can be a ballroom dancer and still be incorrect. That's like saying well I'm Boris Johnson, so I know everything about politics. A lower centre of gravity is fine, I didn't talk about a lower centre of gravity, I said he is hunched in every dance. Different. I don't appreciate you being so harsh with your tone but you're passionate. Lets just move past this... I'm afraid I can't quite move past this yet, because you still seem to be confusing fact and opinion (which is why your analogy to politics doesn't work in the slightest). Technical correctness in dance is a matter of fact, not opinion. Whether a step is danced on a heel lead or toe first is a matter of fact - for each different step, one is correct and the other is not - there are books on the subject of technique that everyone follows. That is the case regardless of what you think of a dancer's STYLE, which is the wholly subjective element. Dancers are judged on both, on Strictly and everywhere else. Therefore a statement that Saffron is technically below average is just factually incorrect. A statement that you personally find her to be a below average dancer overall is not, as that is your opinion. If you accept that you are not trying to state facts but rather commenting on her dance style, then we can agree to disagree. And on the centre of gravity point, I know you said hunched, I didnt dsagree with that, I was just trying to explain what the reason for that hunched appearance might have been. Ok, I think Saffron is a below average dancer. Moving on... |
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Post by theatreian on Nov 18, 2019 17:36:28 GMT
Too often people let emotion rule their judgement about dance when it should all come down to the black and white. Technique, technique, technique. If it doesn't, it just turns dance into a laughing stock and ruins the integrity of the art. Surely part of the art of dance is its performance value and how it excites and entertains the audience. If it was purely technique then we could have a robotic machine to perform the steps correctly without any of the performance value and personality that some of the couples give. That in my eyes anyway is what separates the couples. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 18, 2019 17:41:21 GMT
Too often people let emotion rule their judgement about dance when it should all come down to the black and white. Technique, technique, technique. If it doesn't, it just turns dance into a laughing stock and ruins the integrity of the art. Surely part of the art of dance is its performance value and how it excites and entertains the audience. If it was purely technique then we could have a robotic machine to perform the steps correctly without any of the performance value and personality that some of the couples give. That in my eyes anyway is what separates the couples. I can see what you're saying. Maybe I should have said that technique should come before anything else. You can have great energy and chemistry as a couple, but if your skill and technique are poor; then that SHOULD be focused on more. |
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Post by irisjeregenboog on Nov 18, 2019 21:02:28 GMT
Coming in with some very naive and positive opinions after having just caught up with Saturday's show. Let me just say that I really like this show: I think it is just superfun. It's not perfect, but then: nothing is ever really perfect, right? I don't know anything about technique (it's only the second season of Strictly I'm watching, so I am only slowly starting to learn which dances are supposed to have which content  ), but I do know that a lot of the dances are very entertaining. From a complete amateur's perspective, I'd say Karim and Kelvin as consistently performing (technically) really well. I really like Karim and Amy as a pairing and I think it's nice to see someone so ambitious and willing to work hard to make the dance look good. I am completely blown away by Oti every time, so I appreciate Kelvin's dances as well. Personal favourites for entertainment value are Alex and Neil (I think they are so good together! Really hope they will make it far into the competition!) and I think Chris is pretty funny and really tries hard. I also appreciate Saffron and AJ and I would like to see them go further into the competition as well. I don't really like Anton (he comes across as a bit arrogant? Just me? And he seems to not really care about Emma, but maybe that's just me interpreting things wrong. The other couples seem to be much closer and actual friends). I didn't have particularly strong feelings about Michelle, although I would've thought they would stay in the competition longer, with Chris or Emma leaving before Michelle. Oh well. As far as I'm concerned, we are saying goodbye to Emma and Anton next week, and then in the end, if it were up to me, the final would consist of Alex and Neil, Karim and Amy, and Kelvin and Oti (or Saffron and AJ? aaah... so hard!!), with Alex or Karim taking the glitterball home  Excited for next week!! |
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Post by foxa on Nov 18, 2019 23:07:02 GMT
I liked Michelle on the show - I didn't know who she was before the series and thought her first dance and the Halloween dance were, in particular, highlights. But Americans often struggle with the public vote and her last two dances weren't as strong. The Vogue number was a risk and one of the problems with it is that it isn't a couple's dance and I thought Giovanni (who I normally love) struggled with it. He choreographed brilliantly for her other weeks, but he was out of his comfort zone in that dance. However, her story was interesting and Blackpool's not a bad week to go out.
In terms of entertainment, I regularly enjoy Kelvin, Karim, Alex and Chris. I think AJ has done fantastic work with Saffron and I liked their Blackpool dance. Like irisjeregenboog above, I'm not enthusiastic about Emma and Anton - in terms of their dancing, chemistry, entertainment value or 'journey.' But they obviously have their fans.
A couple of seasons back, I thought the formula had got a bit tired, but then it seemed to bounce back with a couple of good years. Family entertainment is tricky to get right. This year may be a bit of a dip, but not (I would say) disastrous - and all the better if you watch it on iplayer and skip through a lot of the VTs. :-)
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Post by oxfordsimon on Nov 23, 2019 19:16:02 GMT
Never. EVER. Let Bruno sing again.
And that was a bad samba. Felt underpowered throughout
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Post by oxfordsimon on Nov 23, 2019 19:27:08 GMT
Karim. That's how to do it.
And Motsi looks naked with the way they frame her comments shots. Bad planning.
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Post by oxfordsimon on Nov 23, 2019 19:35:55 GMT
Woeful choreo for the AT. Poor delivery. Too many mistakes.
Far beyond her capabilities
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Post by Deleted on Nov 23, 2019 19:36:10 GMT
I think I'm watching a different show to the judges. Whenever I think someone is... not great, they get 10s.
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Post by oxfordsimon on Nov 23, 2019 19:47:11 GMT
Kelvin and Oti.... costumes are ugly.
Choreography misses the mark.
Really wasn't engaging at all.
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Post by oxfordsimon on Nov 23, 2019 19:51:08 GMT
No way was that worth 10s.
Judges need a reality check
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Post by oxfordsimon on Nov 23, 2019 19:55:35 GMT
QS ... mistakes galore.
And a cheap wig.
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Post by oxfordsimon on Nov 23, 2019 20:03:35 GMT
Paso... he tries hard. There was some good choreo. But he is the weakest dancer left
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Post by irisjeregenboog on Nov 23, 2019 20:11:41 GMT
Haven't seen the full dances yet (youtube uploads should be faster!), but I am anticipating a dance off between Emma and Anton and Saffron and AJ. Not sure who would go through of those two, although I hope Saffron and AJ would go through. I really, really hope Alex avoids the dance off and will stay in the competition until the end! It seemed like a solid attempt of the Argentine Tango and apparently it's a hard dance so... through to another week, please?
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Post by Deleted on Nov 23, 2019 20:19:05 GMT
So many sob stories this week. Some of the VT's were longer than the dances themselves. Get on with it. Karim's dance had zero emotion and craig was right to mention it, but then give it a 9?? overmarked.
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Post by justfran on Nov 23, 2019 21:23:29 GMT
I thought that was the wrong song for Saffron and AJ’s dance, it also seemed too slow for a samba especially at the beginning.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 23, 2019 22:23:34 GMT
Karim. That's how to do it. How to do a frantic out of sync 100mph set of moves, yes, but not a dance with any kind of light and shade. Craig summed it up perfectly (but then overmarked it). What a rubbish show, no dance was worth more than a 9 and I'd only have given that to Kelvin because he was slightly better than Karim. The rest were varying degrees of mistake-ridden and dull (Emma) to dreadful (Alex). When is this series going to get remotely good?! |
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Post by justfran on Nov 23, 2019 22:39:36 GMT
I agree that Craig’s marks didn’t seem to match his scores with Karim and Kelvin - he seemed to give much more positivity to Kelvin yet marked Karim higher?
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Post by alicechallice on Nov 23, 2019 23:02:25 GMT
So many sob stories this week. Some of the VT's were longer than the dances themselves. Get on with it. Karim's dance had zero emotion and craig was right to mention it, but then give it a 9?? overmarked. All the couple's choice dances have the longer VT |
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Post by BurlyBeaR on Nov 24, 2019 10:00:12 GMT
I don’t know what that Commercial dance that Kelvin did was supposed to be but it certainly wasn’t Northern Soul. Lots of faffing about with cups at the table and rolling about on the floor, and very little actual NS despite the styling and the song used. Hated it 😐
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Post by freckles on Nov 24, 2019 11:18:07 GMT
Happy to hear it’s Musicals week next week. Bit earlier than usual.
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Post by craig on Nov 24, 2019 11:52:10 GMT
I've loved Strictly for over a decade but I've really lost interest this series.
I used to think it didn't matter who they cast as the show was so big, but this series has proven otherwise. It's been such a lacklustre / low rent lineup and it's really cheapened the brand.
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), but I do know that a lot of the dances are very entertaining. From a complete amateur's perspective, I'd say Karim and Kelvin as consistently performing (technically) really well. I really like Karim and Amy as a pairing and I think it's nice to see someone so ambitious and willing to work hard to make the dance look good. I am completely blown away by Oti every time, so I appreciate Kelvin's dances as well. Personal favourites for entertainment value are Alex and Neil (I think they are so good together! Really hope they will make it far into the competition!) and I think Chris is pretty funny and really tries hard. I also appreciate Saffron and AJ and I would like to see them go further into the competition as well. I don't really like Anton (he comes across as a bit arrogant? Just me? And he seems to not really care about Emma, but maybe that's just me interpreting things wrong. The other couples seem to be much closer and actual friends). I didn't have particularly strong feelings about Michelle, although I would've thought they would stay in the competition longer, with Chris or Emma leaving before Michelle. Oh well. 
Excited for next week!! 
