19,793 posts
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Post by BurlyBeaR on Apr 1, 2022 18:45:19 GMT
I post the above because I thought it was interesting.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 1, 2022 18:52:45 GMT
Talking of DSB I bet she'd have slapped anyone interrupting her spot
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Post by sph on Apr 1, 2022 21:53:19 GMT
I agree that more could be done to make it less about the comedy and more about the film industry, but that's not really as new as you'd think. The Oscars have always been hit and miss with a few cringeworthy "bits". Some of them career-endingly bad.
I would like to see more explained about who is who in the Academy and what they have done. Maybe give out the lifetime achievement and honorary Oscars etc on the actual main show - that would be fascinating to me. But I guess for the rest of the public not so, otherwise they'd do it.
I do personally prefer wit to all-out put-downs when it comes to comedy. Although I think Ricky Gervais does the perfect level of knocking celebrities off their pedestal if they take themselves too seriously.
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4,156 posts
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Post by kathryn on Apr 1, 2022 23:31:35 GMT
Why should she cover herself up? She shouldn’t. And the primary reason why she shouldn’t is that she looks absolutely beautiful. Just like Demi Moore did in GI Jane. *shrug* I suspect the beef between the Smiths and Rock was pre-existing, and that it really isn’t about this joke, which while it might be poor taste, is no worse than any of the other poor taste jokes made at award shows. It’s not like he made a joke about someone who had an alcohol-affected mental health crisis that required time off a high-profile job and could have wrecked their career.
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Post by oxfordsimon on Apr 1, 2022 23:41:24 GMT
Smith has now resigned from the Academy
That won't be the end of it.
He will still face further sanctions after 18th April
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Post by inthenose on Apr 2, 2022 5:07:21 GMT
Good playwrights shine a light on human behaviour. Many a play can teach us how good people can behave badly when put in positions of extreme stress. And we nod along, because we know it's true from our own experiences. So it's sad that this website apes the worst of social media, by seeing this event in black and white terms, rushes to judgement, and doesn't seek to understand why what happened happened. I have no idea whether Will Smith is a "good guy" or not, but I wouldn't judge him based on this one incident. When the person in the wrong plainly apologises, where does that leave your above words? "The list of those I have hurt is long and includes Chris, his family, many of my dear friends and loved ones, all those in attendance, and global audiences at home," Smith said on Friday. "I betrayed the trust of the Academy. I deprived other nominees and winners of their opportunity to celebrate and be celebrated for their extraordinary work. I am heartbroken."
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1,485 posts
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Post by mkb on Apr 2, 2022 8:17:08 GMT
(I thought we'd done this to death, but since you've quoted me...)
You'll have to explain further, because I don't see how what I wrote is in any way affected by a subsequent apology.
Let's assume, realistically, that the statement from Smith is part sincere (if mainly PR management), then that goes to underline my contention that all good people are capable of bad things given the right (i.e. wrong) circumstances, and it's to be expected that they will feel bad and contrite about what they have done.
My issue is with the social media onslaught where this is seen as something extraordinary that requires special punishment rather than understanding. The baying for blood is the worser aspect of human nature concerning this incident, because it's done with reflection in the cold light of day.
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Post by jojo on Apr 2, 2022 8:35:36 GMT
I like to think Will worked it out for himself and realised that it was better for him to offer his resignation than for him to force the Academy to suspend or revoke his membership. It might seem obvious to most people, but perhaps not so easy for him when there are so many sycophants making excuses. Hopefully this shows he's got good friends who have been honest with him.
I expect the Academy will have to make a statement too, but I expect it will walk a fine line. They need to condemn what he did, and reflect on their own inaction on the night too. But we all know that everyone wants him back in again in the future.
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4,214 posts
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Post by anthony40 on Apr 2, 2022 18:08:15 GMT
You know how in cartoons when a character gets slapped how they usually spin on an axis from the impact and their eyes roll about in the head? I swear that what I saw on Chris Rock's face when I first saw the clip of what occurred.
Possibly a combination if the physical impact and the shock of what had just occurred I suspect.
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2,060 posts
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Post by Marwood on Apr 2, 2022 19:17:05 GMT
Apart from not being able to attend the Oscar’s ceremony (or vote for it) and being excluded from social events put on by the Academy (and bodies linked to it), will this really affect his career? Looking on IMDB it says he has 9 upcoming projects but I doubt if even a quarter of them have actually shot any footage (if that) but will this affect his draw when it comes to financing a film? Personally I think he put a brave face on through the last few years following the disclosures about his wife and other men and the Chris Rock thing in front of his peers was the last straw.
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Post by oxfordsimon on Apr 2, 2022 19:34:46 GMT
I believe that being kicked out of the Screen Actors Guild might be more significant and they have said they are investigating the incident and how to respond.
That would, as I understand things, limit his right to be in films.
I suspect sales for his theatre tour later in the year might be affected
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3,040 posts
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Post by crowblack on Apr 2, 2022 21:45:46 GMT
If Hollywood is that bothered and setting an example and all that, maybe it should have a think about the phenomenal number of acts of violence in the films it churns out aimed at children and young people. Is there a punch/kick/bullet/stab/rape/beheading count? That's what the teenagers stabbing and shooting each other on the streets are watching, not the Oscar ceremony.
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Post by stuartmcd on Apr 2, 2022 22:24:04 GMT
If Hollywood is that bothered and setting an example and all that, maybe it should have a think about the phenomenal number of acts of violence in the films it churns out aimed at children and young people. Is there a punch/kick/bullet/stab/rape/beheading count? That's what the teenagers stabbing and shooting each other on the streets are watching, not the Oscar ceremony. What movies aimed at children have rape in them?
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3,040 posts
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Post by crowblack on Apr 2, 2022 22:38:50 GMT
What movies aimed at children have rape in them? I said 'children and young people', the rape / sexual violence plotlines turning up more in the latter, and 'certification' doesn't mean anything these days. Many people let their kids watch things like Game of Thrones. How many acts of violence do you reckon take place in the average Marvel movie? The latest Marvel/Disney production, Moon Knight, out this week and starring an actor best known from Star Wars, is actually advertised on Disney's own twitter feed with the image of a pet goldfish in a food blender.
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Post by Marwood on Apr 2, 2022 22:42:32 GMT
I haven’t seen that advert but I saw the first episode of Moon Knight last week and while there is a goldfish in it, it didn’t end up in a blender (I really enjoyed it)
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3,040 posts
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Post by crowblack on Apr 2, 2022 22:49:04 GMT
DisneyPlus, Marvel and the MoonKnight blue tick Twitter accounts all tweeted the image on 29th March, with thousands and thousands of 'likes'.
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4,156 posts
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Post by kathryn on Apr 2, 2022 23:21:07 GMT
If Hollywood is that bothered and setting an example and all that, maybe it should have a think about the phenomenal number of acts of violence in the films it churns out aimed at children and young people. Is there a punch/kick/bullet/stab/rape/beheading count? That's what the teenagers stabbing and shooting each other on the streets are watching, not the Oscar ceremony. Most people can tell the difference between fictional violence and real violence. 🙄
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Post by Deleted on Apr 3, 2022 4:09:41 GMT
What movies aimed at children have rape in them? I said 'children and young people', the rape / sexual violence plotlines turning up more in the latter, and 'certification' doesn't mean anything these days. Many people let their kids watch things like Game of Thrones. How many acts of violence do you reckon take place in the average Marvel movie? The latest Marvel/Disney production, Moon Knight, out this week and starring an actor best known from Star Wars, is actually advertised on Disney's own twitter feed with the image of a pet goldfish in a food blender. He carries the goldfish in the blender. To transport it. He doesn't blend it. I literally just watched it 5 minutes ago. And he uses it because it's the one thing near he grabs in his disorientation. And I'd hope that most people know the difference between Marvel superheroes smashing villains and actual violence in the real life big, bad world.
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856 posts
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Post by stuartmcd on Apr 3, 2022 7:22:30 GMT
What movies aimed at children have rape in them? I said 'children and young people', the rape / sexual violence plotlines turning up more in the latter, and 'certification' doesn't mean anything these days. Many people let their kids watch things like Game of Thrones. How many acts of violence do you reckon take place in the average Marvel movie? The latest Marvel/Disney production, Moon Knight, out this week and starring an actor best known from Star Wars, is actually advertised on Disney's own twitter feed with the image of a pet goldfish in a food blender. Tell me you haven’t watched Moon Knight without telling me you haven’t watched Moon Knight.
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3,040 posts
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Post by crowblack on Apr 3, 2022 9:30:34 GMT
Tell me you haven’t watched Moon Knight without telling me you haven’t watched Moon Knight. The image was released before the show opened, and no, I'm not going to watch a series that chooses that image of the thousands it could have chosen for its promo material. When I was at art college in the 1990s some a-hole put a goldfish in a blender. It's not an 'innocent' image. Most people can tell the difference between fictional violence and real violence. Most people, but not all. I heard a well known male actor defending the sexual violence in one of his films saying no normal person would be turned on by that. It's not 'normal' people I worry about when I'm walking down the street at night, and the watch and rewatch pause, gif culture is very different from the linear form of narrative viewing of old. The teenage gang who punched a friend of mine to death went home and watched a violent gangland film immediately afterwards. A group of young men involved in drug gang violence interviewed on the radio recently described how when they walked the streets they thought of themselves as being in a violent computer game, detached from reality. A Clockwork Orange was withdrawn for years because of a copycat killing and attacks. A sex worker who was quite well known near my school was murdered in Jack the Ripper style attack the week a Ripper drama was shown on TV.
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Post by sfsusan on Apr 3, 2022 11:04:31 GMT
Won't aberrant people find justification for their actions in almost anything? And people in groups are notably willing/able to collectively act out their worst impulses, egging each other on.
Do we censor/self-censor everything that someone with a kink finds arousing/inspiring?
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Post by crowblack on Apr 3, 2022 11:46:41 GMT
Do we censor/self-censor everything that someone with a kink finds arousing/inspiring? No, but I think the attitude now is that with streaming/internet/twitter real dead body and beheading videos, the floodgates have opened regarding who has access to what, so anything goes, so who cares anymore? There's a good radio programme (still on iplayer, I think) called Body Count Rising on the trend towards sexual violence in screen drama, and a generation is growing up who spend more of their leisure time immersed in a virtual world of fantasy and gaming than learning how to interact with real human beings face to face in the real one. Films that were late night when I was a kid are mid afternoon now. Last Sunday's BBC1 primetime 9pm period drama featured a throat cutting/garotting with piano wire and a naked man having his genitals hacked off - that sort of image used to be late night BBC2 or Ch4, if shown at all. The same screenwriter did a recent version of A Christmas Carol with a scene where Scrooge forces Mrs Cratchit to strip naked to humiliate her. Edgy, pushing the envelope? Do we need that envelope pushing? Is it making society less or more desensitised and violent? That's the discussion I'd like Hollywood and Silicone Valley to be having, not hysteria on one of the rare times a tiny bit of violence actually seeps into their gilded halls.
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Post by sfsusan on Apr 3, 2022 12:39:56 GMT
That's the discussion I'd like Hollywood and Silicone Valley to be having I agree that calling for that discussion is legitimate. But, especially on a theater board, I would say that we need that envelope-pushing... it's basically one of the functions of art. (Without the envelope being pushed, we wouldn't need that discussion and I think society benefits from self-examination.)
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Post by stuartmcd on Apr 3, 2022 12:55:48 GMT
There’s plenty of violence in tv shows and movies of course. But they all go through certification to make sure they are appropriately labelled so people know what they are getting into. Even some streaming shows now include trigger warnings at the start.
If young people end up watching this content then that’s bad parenting. Same way that if a child is playing the latest Call of Duty or Grand Theft Auto game. It’s not the fault of the developers when the game is clearly labelled as an 18.
Why would there be any hysteria in Hollywood about this? They have certification boards to make sure that all of the content is appropriately vetted. It’s then down to us as the audience to decide what we then want to watch.
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Post by crowblack on Apr 3, 2022 13:19:56 GMT
I agree that calling for that discussion is legitimate. But, especially on a theater board, I would say that we need that envelope-pushing... it's basically one of the functions of art. (Without the envelope being pushed, we wouldn't need that discussion and I think society benefits from self-examination.) I think more discussion is needed on which way the envelope is being pushed and towards whom, and the atmosphere being created in the mainstream, not the avant-garde late-night fringes. On the one hand, we have 20th century and even quite recent (2000s) shows being edited or removed from streamers altogether because of changing sensitivities around language or stereotypes, so there is a debate around sensitivity and the influence of media in creating an atmosphere there, but on the other hand physical violence including sexual violence onscreen has become more extreme and realistic (social media from war zones and terrorist attacks has meant more of us now know what real wounds and death looks like, and the special effects people have, as it were 'upped their game'). And when people say, well, let's address that too, it's 'oh, there's no proof it has any influence on human behaviour, stop pearl clutching'
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