Queer? No ta.

Can I call black people the N word on that basis then?

What utter cobblers.

Is it ok for a straight person to call me queer?

How are people supposed to know?

I'm not talking about people talking to me face to face Daniel. If people call me Matt, which they often do initially, I'm very happy to tell them it's actually Matthew. That's quite different to the generic term 'queer' becoming accepted.

What next, Fairies?

Some people moaned about Gay being used as a term when kids described things as a bit gay. But as it is openly used I'd use it in all contexts.

Queer, Fairies, Puffs are certainly old terms you don't hear much these days and the countations of queer could be considered unpleasant.

The history of the N-Word is certainly complicated and it being used in Rap could encourage people to use it without understanding the offence.

The word "Coloured" was used a lot and not considered offensive in the 1970's and 1980's but I can remember someone telling me in about 1994 that it was now considered racist, I said "Don't be stupid" but thinking about it, I stopped using that word. But I still know people who will use it quite innocently and I would not think of them as racist.

The P-Word is even more cloudy, considering the country Pakistan was only established in 1947 and a countries' name can often be shortened to denote it's people. But as long as I've known this word has always been off limits (35 years plus in my memory. I'm never sure when it became considered offensive but I'm guessing 1970's.

I can once remember watching some cricket highlights from Australia on Channel 4 with an asian friend, we were probably 14 or so at the time and Pakistan were playing and took a wicket and the Aussie commentator said "the P's are going mad" quite innocently. My friend's father started screaming at the TV and it created a very tense atmosphere.

The mention of Yid reminds me of the brilliant episode of Till Death Us Do Part when Mike - the Scouse Git calls Alf Garnett a Yid and Alf goes spare. The late great Warren Mitchell was of course Jewish so implying Alf was Jewish worked perfectly.

On a final lighter note how about reviving Honky Tonk as a saying after the old Dick Emery camp character.

We all know this conversation would've been shut down by now if a certain admin didn't want the attention. He can say what he likes but we can't.

When this board gets shut down, remind me to set up the next one as quickly as possible so I can be exempt from any questions.

Bye guys.

BurlyBear, I understand you were trying to have a conversation, but obtusely saying if gays can reclaim the word queer, then can I say the N word is an asshole and purposely inflammatory thing to say. In fact, I would like to say that you WANT to say the N word and clearly take it lightly, because this wouldn't have crossed your mind otherwise. You know better. Stop being ignorant.

On to the Queer conversation, as someone else mentioned, it's for individuals or groups that don't fit into the gay/lesbian binary. You're gay, and so am I. Lucky for us. There are people who don't identify as such, and are not heterosexual either. There are other cultures or disciplines that have formerly referred to non-binary confining groups as the third sex. Call it what you will, but at this day and age, with homosexuality and "gay" being a norm in many places, certainly big cities, it's clear that gays (especially cis, white and male) forget the struggle and start exercising the same discrimination or ignorance that was inflected on them easily two decades ago, and just want their equal share of patriarchy.

So...you're basically saying if in some "culture" it's okay to use the N-word or faggot (which culture is that btw? the superior white race?), then they should go ahead and say it and the group that is offended by this has no right to be offended. Is that what you're saying? Ah, okay. Thank you clarifying. I'm glad we're using white supremacy as a benchmark.

Not wishing to drift wildly off topic it appears to have become acceptable for the white yoots in brighton and possibly elsewhere to refer to each other as my N. Absolutely makes me cringe

Of course I'm not saying that and I'm certain you know I'm not saying that, so I really don't know why you posted something so antagonistic. I don't know where the white supremacy thing came from.

I'll illustrate the point with a non-race, non-gay example. Back during a recent athletics championship a US competitor being interviewed on UK TV referred to someone or something as "spastic", prompting a subsequent apology from the presenter. In the UK that's an offensive term for someone disabled. In the US it's a non-offensive term for being over-excited. It's the same word, but the meaning is completely different. What I am saying is that people brought up to know the UK meaning of the word should stop and think "That's offensive to me but she's from the US and it's not offensive to her, and there's no reason why I should be allowed to dictate what her culture is permitted to find offensive". What they should not do is eagerly seize the chance to start berating someone for failing to study every culture and commit all their preferences to memory in order to make sure nothing that is said could possibly be interpreted as offensive by anyone.

People should be tolerant and consider someone's intent, not twist words and leap at the chance to show off how outraged they are. If someone uses a word that's OK to them and then finds out that it's offensive to someone else then they should certainly try to avoid using it (although ingrained habits are hard to change), and it's obviously a very different matter if someone is told "we don't use that word over here" and then goes out of their way to use it as much as possible. But most people are reasonable and try to do the right thing, and other reasonable people should take that into account. It takes a pretty disgusting sort of person to say "I know that's not offensive to you but I'm going to pretend you were trying to be offensive so I can show off my moral rectitude".