2,297 posts
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Post by theglenbucklaird on May 31, 2024 16:50:34 GMT
That would be the dignified response But she will stand. Eh?
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4,849 posts
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Post by Phantom of London on May 31, 2024 17:24:00 GMT
The old troop - is that you need more conviction Politicians, like Donald Trump.
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Post by Deleted on May 31, 2024 20:29:29 GMT
My priorities would be
1. Sort the NHS out including free prescriptions for England the same as the other UK countries 2. Ensure every homeless British person has the offer of a roof over their head 3. Scrap the TV licence fee that would be an extra £170 approx to hard up families.
The Diane Abbott saga is a bit of fun but it won't affect Sir Kier becoming PM. Her hand did look very shaky when she was holding the mic whilst speaking yesterday so I hope it isn't a health issue.
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3,040 posts
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Post by crowblack on May 31, 2024 21:59:56 GMT
I hope she does stand, and I hope she wins. She doesn't look well - she was shaking at that rally and had to be helped by literal supporters. My sibling lives in her constituency - it's still an area with a lot of issues and problems as has been tragically highlighted again this week and it needs someone on the ball at the helm (sorry to mix metaphors there). I suppose if the whip removal hadn't happened she might have retired earlier - no one wants to leave under a cloud. Then again, the longer you go on, the more 'senior moments' you may expose yourself to.
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Post by Deleted on May 31, 2024 23:55:28 GMT
I hope she does stand, and I hope she wins. She doesn't look well - she was shaking at that rally and had to be helped by literal supporters. My sibling lives in her constituency - it's still an area with a lot of issues and problems as has been tragically highlighted again this week and it needs someone on the ball at the helm (sorry to mix metaphors there). I suppose if the whip removal hadn't happened she might have retired earlier - no one wants to leave under a cloud. Then again, the longer you go on, the more 'senior moments' you may expose yourself to. If there is an "issue" with her health then those wishing her to step down may well have briefed journalists about it or drawn attention to it. But if her mind is still sound then she has every right to stand.
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5,112 posts
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Post by TallPaul on Jun 1, 2024 8:54:01 GMT
Could we please stop speculating on someone's health. Let's stick to her record as an MP.
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5,668 posts
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Post by lynette on Jun 1, 2024 9:28:45 GMT
No matter if she stands or not , the constituency will go Labour. If she is in less than good health what is going on? Some kind of ‘let’s get Starmer ‘ statement? Who is using who? The media love a personality to stick it all to and this is playing right into the media’s lowest level. As said in one of our faves, ‘Big mistake, huge.’
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Post by aspieandy on Jun 1, 2024 11:06:47 GMT
Intesting to see Labour's strategy at this early stage is to attack - in Scotland and the Home Counties/Midlands. SNP and Tories not ambitious beyond trying to prevent further erosion. LibDems nibblng at Tory seats along the south coast: 33 days to go?
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Post by matttom0901 on Jun 1, 2024 11:32:00 GMT
I wish I could vote, but unfortunately my British Citizenship application is still being processed. Mind you, I submitted it on 01/05 and UKVI said it usually takes 3-6 months
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4,849 posts
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Post by Phantom of London on Jun 1, 2024 12:12:52 GMT
Latest MRP survey has the Conservatives on 66 seats, with the Liberals on 59. If Ed Davey continues going around the country having fun, this will be the other way around. The poll was conducted by the Tory in house magazine the Daily Telegraph. www.electoralcalculus.co.uk/blogs/ec_vipoll_20240531.html
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Post by Deleted on Jun 1, 2024 12:30:36 GMT
The poll was conducted by the Tory in house magazine the Daily Telegraph. So, not in any way biased then... ![:D](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/grin.png) I don't trust absolutely anything to do with a Tory, they have proven time and time again they cannot be trusted.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 1, 2024 12:49:37 GMT
No matter if she stands or not , the constituency will go Labour. If she is in less than good health what is going on? Some kind of ‘let’s get Starmer ‘ statement? Who is using who? The media love a personality to stick it all to and this is playing right into the media’s lowest level. As said in one of our faves, ‘Big mistake, huge.’ Fair enough we take age and health out of it people a decade older than Diane are standing and many other MPs have health issues. If she had stood as an independent Labour against an "official" Labour candidate which way the vote would go would be of interest. Frank Field who was a long serving MP stood as an independent Labour candidate in 2019 but lost heavily. Are Labour going to field an official candidate against JC and what will be the result there? Anyone "parachuted" into a safe seat with no local connection might not be well received and anyone who was close to the likes of JC or Diane could be seen as a turncoat. I think Labour can afford to have a couple of "independent" MPs who will back a number of their policies given the majority they will get.
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Post by aspieandy on Jun 1, 2024 13:05:18 GMT
Are Labour going to field an official candidate against JC and what will be the result there? They have.
Local party drew up a short list of 6 possible candidates. That somehow got whittled down to two. One of those later withdrew, leaving one unopposed local councillor. Zero democracy, zero accountability.
Could be quite tight here – Labour can pour in resources from all over London if they wish. Many activists won’t want to do it but some will.
Corbyn currently preferring only constituency-living supporters on the doorstep and phone bank.
It's really rare for an MP to stand against his own former party and win. Big name independents usually come from outside.
Diane Abbott: no love lost for her in much of the party. The nasty business got up to when Corbyn was leader .. weak, conniving, can barely remember a policy let alone contribute to creating it. Personally, I feel she's occupying a seat someone with potential could use: distinct aroma of grandeur and entitlement.
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4,849 posts
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Post by Phantom of London on Jun 1, 2024 13:14:35 GMT
Labour just wanted to be seen as right wing to attract right wing voters, every momentum voter that doesn’t vote Labour, well that is worth 1 vote, a former Tory voting Labour is worth 2 votes.
As I thought would happen, that there would be a media mayhem over Diana, then she would be quietly allowed to stand, however as was wrong over quietly.
It’s kind of worked, judging by the opinion polls.
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Post by jojo on Jun 1, 2024 14:59:14 GMT
Are Labour going to field an official candidate against JC and what will be the result there? They have.
Local party drew up a short list of 6 possible candidates. That somehow got whittled down to two. One of those later withdrew, leaving one unopposed local councillor. Zero democracy, zero accountability.
Could be quite tight here – Labour can pour in resources from all over London if they wish. Many activists won’t want to do it but some will.
At risk of sounding like a broken record, most FPTP elections are like that as far as the voting public are concerned. Whether it's the national or local party, most of us have no choice of candidate if we have a firm view on which party we support. And in many constituencies we've no real choice of party either. If it's a safe seat - prepare to be ignored. I do think the Tories are heading for a heavy defeat, and while I think the polls are legit, I don't think they can accurately model the current situation, especially when you factor in boundary changes and so on. There's also a risk of complacency. Older voters are more likely to vote, and a lot of them will vote the same way they've done for all of their voting life. Meanwhile younger voters, often with more left-wing sensibilities have lower turn-out. I don't think the model accurately reflects the Scottish situation where just as many people will be voting anti-SNP as anti-Conservative. That's good news for the SNP and Conservatives in seats where they can both convince voters they are mutual rivals. The LibDems are being open about only targeting seats where they think they've got a decent chance of winning, and trying to resist the temptation to spread themselves too thin, and I think most serious activists are on board after 2019 where they increased vote share, but lost MPs. Albeit that's what put them in the position to have a big increase this year. The Labour leadership have made similar noises, and candidates in unwinnable seats have been instructed to allocate time to campaigning in actual target seats, but it's clear some activists would rather lose valiantly to the Tories than let a LibDem or Green candidate win. It will be interesting to see the effect of so many big beasts standing down. Normally there is an advantage to being the incumbent, and any replacement has to build a profile, but I'm pretty sure 'vote for us to beat Michael Gove' was an effective motivation for tactical voting.
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Post by oxfordsimon on Jun 1, 2024 16:20:36 GMT
What I am not hearing or seeing is any real enthusiasm for the likely winners. This was not the cast back in 1997 when a similar sweeping victory was on the cards, there was a real sense of enthusiasm for a Blair win. Not the false confidence of the Kinnock Sheffield Rally, but a real feeling that there was hope in the air.
Now many would say that it was a false hope and/or it was never delivered as promised.
But it doesn't feel like there is any passion for Starmer as PM. Which could mean this is the most negative election in living history.
Voting against rather than for.
It all feels very strange.
No one seems to be putting forward a real and credible reason to vote for them other than not being their opponents.
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Post by aspieandy on Jun 1, 2024 17:55:32 GMT
.. and yet almost 80% (above) already know how they will vote. That's not "enthusism" but it is conviction a week into the election campaigns.
I hardly know anyone who didn't - almost instinctively - know how they would vote the moment they heard.
The big change between Labour in '97 and now is the social penetration of all things internet - data, sentiment, social media, etc. All in real time. Blair was surprised by the scale of the landslide.
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Post by vdcni on Jun 1, 2024 18:07:58 GMT
Worth noting much of the media and the Tories were claiming there was no real enthusiasm for Labour in 1997.
I think there is less this time, what Starmer stands for isn't as clear as it was for Blair, but I don't think that's particularly unusual.
Plus the failings of the Tory government and condition of the country are much worse now than in 1997 so that tends to overwhelm the conversation.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 1, 2024 18:32:43 GMT
What I am not hearing or seeing is any real enthusiasm for the likely winners. This was not the cast back in 1997 when a similar sweeping victory was on the cards, there was a real sense of enthusiasm for a Blair win. Not the false confidence of the Kinnock Sheffield Rally, but a real feeling that there was hope in the air. I always wonder if Kinnock at that big Rally in 1992 when he started doing oggy oggy oggy did cost Labour votes and showed floating voters that Neil Kinnock wasn't Pm material. I've heard stories that the late John Smith along with other senior party members were stood on the side of the stage with their heads in their hands.,
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4,849 posts
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Post by Phantom of London on Jun 1, 2024 18:57:20 GMT
The last time there was any real political enthusiasm was the 2016 referendum and see where that got us.
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1,451 posts
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Post by mkb on Jun 1, 2024 19:18:13 GMT
What I am not hearing or seeing is any real enthusiasm for the likely winners. This was not the cast back in 1997 when a similar sweeping victory was on the cards, there was a real sense of enthusiasm for a Blair win. Not the false confidence of the Kinnock Sheffield Rally, but a real feeling that there was hope in the air. I always wonder if Kinnock at that big Rally in 1992 when he started doing oggy oggy oggy did cost Labour votes and showed floating voters that Neil Kinnock wasn't Pm material. I've heard stories that the late John Smith along with other senior party members were stood on the side of the stage with their heads in their hands., ... but all stories that came out with the benefit of hindsight. Kinnock always had an uphill task because of the scale of the press onslaught. Blair and Starmer, in contrast, are in deference to the press barons.
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Post by Jan on Jun 1, 2024 19:21:16 GMT
If the story’s true, it was agreed she was supposed to be reinstated, announce she was stepping down, they’d issue some blandishments thanking her for decades of service, and then off she’d go. Instead they briefed the media against her. I hope she does stand, and I hope she wins. She was suspended for saying, in a letter, that Jews, Travellers, and Irish can’t be subject to racism. And you hope she wins.
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Post by Jan on Jun 1, 2024 19:28:05 GMT
The NHS has had above inflation spending increases every single year the Conservatives have been in power both in absolute and over the whole period in per capita terms too and yet it has got worse in terms of waiting lists and patient outcomes compared to EU mixed public/private insurance based systems like the Netherlands. Do Labour voters not worry that simply spending even more on it simply won’t work ? For example if you give junior doctors a 35% pay increase as they want how will that improve matters ?
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Post by crowblack on Jun 1, 2024 19:35:26 GMT
There was enthusiasm for 'New Labour' in the 90s - we knew who the personalities were before the election, there was a 'story' and a 'journey', we had a clear idea of where they stood even if those of us further Left weren't happy about some of their agenda. There are no political 'big beasts' now in the way there were then. Bluntly, I don't think Starmer and co are as intelligent as their predecessors. We're very much in an era of second, even third rate politicians here and in the USA.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 1, 2024 19:40:04 GMT
If the story’s true, it was agreed she was supposed to be reinstated, announce she was stepping down, they’d issue some blandishments thanking her for decades of service, and then off she’d go. Instead they briefed the media against her. I hope she does stand, and I hope she wins. She was suspended for saying, in a letter, that Jews, Travellers, and Irish can’t be subject to racism. And you hope she wins. While I don't agree with what she said, it is nowhere near as bad as the comments coming out of senior Tory members over the years, so would rather she wins over the Tories.
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