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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2017 4:35:07 GMT
I love you and your posts! We're always on the same page on basically everything!
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Post by Michael on Feb 24, 2017 5:21:17 GMT
And I have to admit I don't really understand why if you wanted to avoid being spoiled you ventured into this thread - it's not difficult to avoid a thread/avoid reviews/avoid listening to the score or Youtube videos etc. until you've seen a show if you're desperate to go into it blind, like I'm doing with resisting downloading the Hamilton cast recording before December! That's all entirely within your control, it just depends how much you want to be going into a show completely blind. Just my opinion though. I couldn't have said it better myself. If you don't want to know, don't read the thread. Problem solved.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2017 7:42:11 GMT
And I have to admit I don't really understand why if you wanted to avoid being spoiled you ventured into this thread - it's not difficult to avoid a thread/avoid reviews/avoid listening to the score or Youtube videos etc. until you've seen a show if you're desperate to go into it blind, like I'm doing with resisting downloading the Hamilton cast recording before December! That's all entirely within your control, it just depends how much you want to be going into a show completely blind. Just my opinion though. I couldn't have said it better myself. If you don't want to know, don't read the thread. Problem solved. So we are free to talk about huge show spoilers open and freely in respective threads without using the spoiler tag that mods ask us to use all the time? Well that makes my life easier then, I'll remember that and if anyone tells me off for that I will bring them back to this thread then. Problem solved, thank you for clarifying.
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Post by shady23 on Feb 24, 2017 8:17:43 GMT
If I am planning on seeing a show I don't really look at a thread when it's started as I don't want to read anything about it, even the little things. Big things should probably have a spoiler notice though, I am sure if someone revealed "the secret" in the Harry Potter thread, folk would not be best pleased.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2017 8:29:31 GMT
Seriously though, we have people actively using the spoiler tags in the *HAMLET* thread for crying out loud, I don't see how danieljohnson14's request is so unreasonable in this case?!
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2017 8:35:41 GMT
I couldn't have said it better myself. If you don't want to know, don't read the thread. Problem solved. So we are free to talk about huge show spoilers open and freely in respective threads without using the spoiler tag that mods ask us to use all the time? Well that makes my life easier then, I'll remember that and if anyone tells me off for that I will bring them back to this thread then. Problem solved, thank you for clarifying. When a show is in the public domain, has public, well known source material that has been out there for years and basically already done in several productions before then yes, I don't see why not - it's not a spoiler if it's easily accessible. Just because someone hasn't read the book or seen the movie doesn't make it a spoiler in that case If it's completely new, no published source material and not even finished previews yet then that's a different story and I think that's fairly obvious - people don't have access to the source material even if they'd wanted to read it. It all does always come back to personal choice though - it is entirely within anyone's control as to whether they get spoiled on a forum as no-one is forcing anyone to click on the thread relating to the show. It's at that person's own risk and as far as I'm concerned the forum shouldn't be policed just because a couple of people haven't seen something that has been widely distributed - once something is that public it is fair game for comment and it's no-one's right to dictate that it shouldn't be discussed (that's also the point of reviews, to discuss a show, and the reviews are out for this). If you know the source material is widely known, as in this case, then there's obviously going to be a risk people will discuss it, so if I wanted to go in completely unspoiled the obvious and easy thing in my mind would be to avoid the thread. Forgive me, but I'm struggling to understand why doing so would be problematic.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2017 8:39:29 GMT
Seriously though, we have people actively using the spoiler tags in the *HAMLET* thread for crying out loud, I don't see how danieljohnson14's request is so unreasonable in this case?! Surely it comes down to the question of what is and isn't a spoiler? In this case the complaint was about a poster revealing part of the plot, a plot which is derived directly from a very widely distributed film and previous play. I haven't read the Hamlet thread, but presumably the only thing that could possibly be remotely spoilery in that would relate to acting choices or staging? In either case I wouldn't really consider those spoilers, and again if I wanted to avoid knowing those details I'd simply avoid the thread until I'd seen the production and leave others to discuss as they please. That's exactly my point about excessive spoiler tag usage being completely unnecessary.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2017 8:45:31 GMT
Ok firstly I think danieljohnson14 has spoken really reasonably about his requests and in this case the original post was quite spoiler-y in terms of the 'how' of this production, so could have disappointed some others given that it's barely open. Likewise the 'how' of the events in Hamlet could be considered spoiler-y again given it's hardly open. I don't really want to see every tiny detail of every production spoiler- tagged because well everything would be hidden! but perhaps an agreement in the early days of a production we spoiler tag the 'how' or 'key plot points' but once something has been open a few months (and reviews are out etc)it becomes 'fair game' and we don't spoiler tag unless it's MAJOR? then it's up to individuals to decide whether they want to read threads or not...
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2017 9:01:29 GMT
I don't know what the situation is in this particular case, but to me a spoiler is when the story is intentionally told in a particular way specifically to withhold certain information until just the right moment, because the effect of the story requires that the audience interpret the preceding events in a manner that would be different if they knew the spoiler.
An example would be a murder mystery where the near-victim who escapes turns out to be the murderer, so the character that appears to be in danger for much of the story is actually the source of the danger. Knowing that in advance would change all the suspense and all the audience's understanding of the relationships between the characters. What wouldn't be a spoiler is "the butler dies", especially if it's preceded by the butler saying "I hear a mysterious noise coming from the cellar. I will investigate it alone, with only this easily-extinguished candle to light my way." It's a murder mystery: of course characters are going to die, and it's not a spoiler to say so.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2017 9:13:41 GMT
Seriously though, we have people actively using the spoiler tags in the *HAMLET* thread for crying out loud, I don't see how danieljohnson14 's request is so unreasonable in this case?! Surely it comes down to the question of what is and isn't a spoiler? In this case the complaint was about a poster revealing part of the plot, a plot which is derived directly from a very widely distributed film and previous play. So by this thought process, Cursed Child is a very, very widly distributed book... so if I read it, I am good to give away spoilers on the general thread because it is widely distributed and therefore I am safe to assume everyone has read it? Because if that is the case, as you are implying,I am happy to oblige when I see the show! To those worrying, I'm not a dick like that, I won't do that. And the person who posted the inital Girls spoiler has apologised and a spoiler tag has been put up for future readers, so I am really over it now. AllI am asking for is curtosy before posting so openly about a show. I always double check and think about what I am posting and think will it spoil it for someone!
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2017 9:20:18 GMT
Surely it comes down to the question of what is and isn't a spoiler? In this case the complaint was about a poster revealing part of the plot, a plot which is derived directly from a very widely distributed film and previous play. So by this thought process, Cursed Child is a very, very widly distributed book... so if I read it, I am good to give away spoilers on the general thread because it is widely distributed and therefore I am safe to assume everyone has read it? Because if that is the case, as you are implying,I am happy to oblige when I see the show! To those worrying, I'm not a dick like that, I won't do that. And the person who posted the inital Girls spoiler has apologised and a spoiler tag has been put up for future readers, so I am really over it now. AllI am asking for is curtosy before posting so openly about a show. I always double check and think about what I am posting and think will it spoil it for someone! To be honest, my opinion on that is that Cursed Child has now been out so long that it's not really a spoiler anymore so I don't particularly see the need for a separate spoiler thread - if people don't want to know the plot then they can avoid the script and the thread. And I say that as someone who doesn't have a ticket until June, so if I wanted to remain unspoiled I'd have to stay out of the thread! Just my opinion though, I only really think spoiler tags are necessary in previews for most things, or until the book is published.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2017 9:28:16 GMT
Nooo, you need a period *after* a book is published, not everyone is going to devour it in the first few hours of purchase. Even if they want to, they might not be physically capable of doing so! I personally reckon at least 24 hours after a TV episode has aired, wait for the DVD release of a film, at least get to press night of a show, and give it ideally a month after a book is published depending on the size of the book. But, y'know, it's okay to still be considerate of spoilers *after* a reasonable time period has gone by, because you don't know who's coming new to the story and people should be able to make their own decisions if they want plot points spoiled (in which case they can look up a synopsis or something) rather than having the decision taken out of their hands.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2017 9:52:21 GMT
I agree about a reasonable period, but the Cursed Child script has been out for about 6 months now, that's pretty reasonable in my mind.
Of course people can still be considerate, my point is more that people shouldn't be stopped from freely discussing something that's familiar or been out for months when if a particular person wants to remain unspoiled they have the freedom of choice to avoid the conversation by not looking at the thread. I asked why that was such an issue as I genuinely don't see how it could be given it's the only sure way of remaining unspoiled no matter what the spoiler tag policy, but I don't think my question has been answered as yet.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2017 9:55:16 GMT
I mean, as with all things, the 'don't be a dick' rule should be applied- a bit of common sense tells you if something is major enough to spoil a production by revealing it. Such things are always relative and I do think that some people are too sensitive to 'spoilers' and should take responsibility for their own 'protection' in that case. But generally if you're doing a Homer Simpson coming out of Star Wars deliberately, then you're being a dick. If you're discussing the thing and unwittingly drop a bombshell you're human.
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Post by wickedgrin on Feb 24, 2017 11:18:31 GMT
Spoilers - it's an interesting discussion though isn't it, this after all is a discussion board although it has gone hopelessly off topic!
I do think people have to take personal responsibility. A spoiler for one person may not be a spoiler for someone else. There has to be a degree of "common sense" - clearly giving away the murderer in a thriller is a spoiler.
The discussion so far has focused on plot spoilers, but when "reviewing" or discussing a show I have seen, I have been open about my thoughts on staging, lighting, sets, choreography etc. Is this spoilerish? Is that even a word? But then you simply would not be able to say anything other than " I did/didn't enjoy this show".
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2017 11:28:57 GMT
Spoilers - it's an interesting discussion though isn't it, this after all is a discussion board although it has gone hopelessly off topic! I do think people have to take personal responsibility. A spoiler for one person may not be a spoiler for someone else. There has to be a degree of "common sense" - clearly giving away the murderer in a thriller is a spoiler. The discussion so far has focused on plot spoilers, but when "reviewing" or discussing a show I have seen, I have been open about my thoughts on staging, lighting, sets, choreography etc. Is this spoilerish? Is that even a word? But then you simply would not be able to say anything other than " I did/didn't enjoy this show". Mods, feel free to merge into that older spoilers thread if we're getting too off topic- I review a fair bit and I try to stay away from spoiling major plot points, and I tend to sign post a bit in the writing if I'm getting into plot points. Sometimes you have to- in order to describe a particularly good moment or set piece or similar it's impossible to completely avoid. And again it depends on the show, so if I was reviewing Pride and Prejudice which I saw last night, I'd assume I had a bit more liberty that people are familiar with the basic plot and it isn't a MASSIVE spoiler to say there's a love story between Darcy and Elizabeth. When I review a new piece of work I try not to reveal too much because as much as my 'job' is to give critique it's not my job to make it so there's no point people seeing it!
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2017 14:30:59 GMT
I'll never forgive Lea Salonga for spoiling Miss Saigon's ending on live television. I don't care if it's a show that originally opened 25 years ago. Not everyone had seen it when the revival opened at the Prince Edward.
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Post by 49thand8th on Feb 24, 2017 15:47:30 GMT
I'll never forgive Lea Salonga for spoiling Miss Saigon's ending on live television. I don't care if it's a show that originally opened 25 years ago. That is... based on an opera that's even older than that, that has the same ending? Man, some of you people are so extra, as the kids say.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2017 15:51:49 GMT
I'll never forgive Lea Salonga for spoiling Miss Saigon's ending on live television. I don't care if it's a show that originally opened 25 years ago. That is... based on an opera that's even older than that, that has the same ending? Man, some of you people are so extra, as the kids say. hahaha
yup.
I did a talk about Rent this week, where I talked about Mimi living at the end of the show, in contrast to La Boheme and I actually said "Spoilers, sorry but it is a 200 year old opera"
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2017 16:55:46 GMT
To be honest, my opinion on that is that Cursed Child has now been out so long that it's not really a spoiler anymore so I don't particularly see the need for a separate spoiler thread - if people don't want to know the plot then they can avoid the script and the thread. And I say that as someone who doesn't have a ticket until June, so if I wanted to remain unspoiled I'd have to stay out of the thread! I think I'd have to politely disagree with you on that, with regard to the Cursed Child. Tickets are exceptionally difficult to get, and many people would rather not read the script before seeing the play. So regardless whether 'it's in the public domain' or not, it is most definitely a show better not spoilt. Even with the two separate threads on here, spoilers have slipped into the specific "no spoilers" thread. To argue that people should avoid threads if they wish to avoid major plot details is also a tad unfair. Many of us - myself included - read most threads for shows which interest me, as a community on here it's where we help one another. By avoiding reading threads we run the risk of missing out on opportunities that others bring to our attention (see the 42nd St. Thread as an example on bargain seats). For what it's worth I agree that potentially big plot details ought to be hidden behind spoiler tags. It takes an extra 30 seconds worth of time to do it, and everyone's happy. No biggie.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2017 17:31:39 GMT
Even with the two separate threads on here, spoilers have slipped into the specific "no spoilers" thread. PLEASE DO report any Potter spoiler that has slipped, as us mods will be happy to remove it. Awful to spoil the fun for others, on that one.It was some months ago, revealing a concealed character's presence which was swiftly dealt with by your people at the time. Alas it was one I'd seen before it was hidden away though.
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