290 posts
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Post by southstreet on Nov 12, 2021 9:58:02 GMT
They may be wearing PPE in work but I dread to think what they are doing outside of it. If they are stupid enough not to take the vaccine then I suspect a large proportion will also belong to the equally-shortsighted anti-mask brigade. And they are all presumably socialising indoors as well, which is fine but a risk. Actually, the only people I know that don't wear masks or test regularly and are behaving like Covid is over are all vaccinated. The people I know that aren't vaccinated are all being a lot more mindful on all the other bits, so I think that is a bit of a rubbish generalization as a lot of vaccinated people seem to lull themselves into a very shortsighted sense of security. "Oh I don't have to do anything else anymore to try and help curb Covid numbers, cos I got vaccinated and everything else is way too much effort." And I know that is only a snapshot of my circles and there will be people both vaccinated and unvaccinated people being lax on all the other mitigating factors. Don't get me wrong, I think everyone should be vaccinated and I am triple vaxxed at this point as I had my booster early last week, but the whole vilification of people that for whatever reason choose not to get vaccinated and the language used to describe them is really starting to irritate me. Also not everyone that isn't vaccinated is an anti-vaxxer!!! I don't take recreational drugs because I don't trust what it'll do to me and how I'll react to it, I also don't smoke and don't really drink other than a cider or glass of bubbly on special occasions and I am a woman that doesn't have a child. But I am not Anti-alcohol or Anti-drugs or Anti-children, I just don't want those things for myself. The only thing out of those that I would be remotely "Anti" on is smoking and mainly cos it bloody stinks! :-) |
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Post by hairspray57 on Nov 12, 2021 12:31:38 GMT
They may be wearing PPE in work but I dread to think what they are doing outside of it. If they are stupid enough not to take the vaccine then I suspect a large proportion will also belong to the equally-shortsighted anti-mask brigade. And they are all presumably socialising indoors as well, which is fine but a risk. Actually, the only people I know that don't wear masks or test regularly and are behaving like Covid is over are all vaccinated. The people I know that aren't vaccinated are all being a lot more mindful on all the other bits, so I think that is a bit of a rubbish generalization as a lot of vaccinated people seem to lull themselves into a very shortsighted sense of security. "Oh I don't have to do anything else anymore to try and help curb Covid numbers, cos I got vaccinated and everything else is way too much effort." And I know that is only a snapshot of my circles and there will be people both vaccinated and unvaccinated people being lax on all the other mitigating factors. Don't get me wrong, I think everyone should be vaccinated and I am triple vaxxed at this point as I had my booster early last week, but the whole vilification of people that for whatever reason choose not to get vaccinated and the language used to describe them is really starting to irritate me. Also not everyone that isn't vaccinated is an anti-vaxxer!!! I don't take recreational drugs because I don't trust what it'll do to me and how I'll react to it, I also don't smoke and don't really drink other than a cider or glass of bubbly on special occasions and I am a woman that doesn't have a child. But I am not Anti-alcohol or Anti-drugs or Anti-children, I just don't want those things for myself. The only thing out of those that I would be remotely "Anti" on is smoking and mainly cos it bloody stinks! :-) Sorry. But anyone who refuse a vaccine is by definition an anti vaxer. Saying they not is pussy footing around what a danger to society they are. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 12, 2021 12:37:58 GMT
Actually, the only people I know that don't wear masks or test regularly and are behaving like Covid is over are all vaccinated. The people I know that aren't vaccinated are all being a lot more mindful on all the other bits, so I think that is a bit of a rubbish generalization as a lot of vaccinated people seem to lull themselves into a very shortsighted sense of security. "Oh I don't have to do anything else anymore to try and help curb Covid numbers, cos I got vaccinated and everything else is way too much effort." And I know that is only a snapshot of my circles and there will be people both vaccinated and unvaccinated people being lax on all the other mitigating factors. Don't get me wrong, I think everyone should be vaccinated and I am triple vaxxed at this point as I had my booster early last week, but the whole vilification of people that for whatever reason choose not to get vaccinated and the language used to describe them is really starting to irritate me. Also not everyone that isn't vaccinated is an anti-vaxxer!!! I don't take recreational drugs because I don't trust what it'll do to me and how I'll react to it, I also don't smoke and don't really drink other than a cider or glass of bubbly on special occasions and I am a woman that doesn't have a child. But I am not Anti-alcohol or Anti-drugs or Anti-children, I just don't want those things for myself. The only thing out of those that I would be remotely "Anti" on is smoking and mainly cos it bloody stinks! :-) Sorry. But anyone who refuse a vaccine is by definition an anti vaxer. Saying they not is pussy footing around what a danger to society they are. Agreed, but with the caveat that it should exclude those with legitimate medical exemptions from vaccination. I think it is unfair to call them anti-vaxxers and was not including them in my post. |
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410 posts
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Post by maggiem on Nov 12, 2021 13:00:33 GMT
I'm double vaccinated and have just booked my booster for 11th December. My brother will be told tonight to call 119 as he doesn't have internet access. I just don't get the anti-vax view!
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290 posts
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Post by southstreet on Nov 12, 2021 13:05:52 GMT
Sorry. But anyone who refuse a vaccine is by definition an anti vaxer. Saying they not is pussy footing around what a danger to society they are. Agreed, but with the caveat that it should exclude those with legitimate medical exemptions from vaccination. I think it is unfair to call them anti-vaxxers and was not including them in my post. Well, we just have to agree to disagree here in terms of the definition. I agree it would be ideal if everyone was vaccinated especially for the health service but the vilification of unvaccinated people is getting on my nerves, especially as I see it a lot from vaccinated people that are doing f*ck all else but having had the vaccine to try and help keeping infections low. At the end of the day, if they are asymptomatic I am more likely to catch covid from an unmasked vaccinated person on the tube or a theatre than a fully masked unvaccinated person and at the moment case rates are so high that it's very likely you'll come across people having Covid and not knowing, because they either are asymptomatic or can't be bothered to test even though they have symptoms. And I am not having a go at either of you Poster J and Hairspray57, I am sure you're doing your bit as well, but it's what I keep seeing around a lot and it's annoying me. Edit: Just to add, I am neither unvaccinated (had my booster, too) nor am I anti-vax!!! |
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170 posts
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Post by jess173 on Nov 12, 2021 14:14:07 GMT
Reports of one region in Austria going to lockdown for the unvaccinated population. Very interesting How on earth are they going to enforce this? Is the police going around town, randomly checking people on the street for their vaccination certificates? Who has time for this? I was in a traffic accident not so long ago. I called the police. It took them more than an hour to come. So this isn’t Austria but I can’t imagine they have the personnel to do this. Today our current health minister introduced a new rule called 2G+ for events. With that only vaccinated people and those who’ve had Covid are allowed to participate but only if they bring a negative test. Unvaccinated aren’t allowed at all. So… why not? Is a negative test from an unvaccinated person less worth than that of someone who’s had the shot? This is really getting ridiculous now. (And also just today a politician encouraged people to not interact with unvaccinated people anymore… You know, we’ve been at this point before in our history. I can’t shake my head enough at this country. I really can’t…) |
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2,505 posts
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Post by zahidf on Nov 12, 2021 14:31:48 GMT
Reports of one region in Austria going to lockdown for the unvaccinated population. Very interesting How on earth are they going to enforce this? Is the police going around town, randomly checking people on the street for their vaccination certificates? Who has time for this? I was in a traffic accident not so long ago. I called the police. It took them more than an hour to come. So this isn’t Austria but I can’t imagine they have the personnel to do this. Today our current health minister introduced a new rule called 2G+ for events. With that only vaccinated people and those who’ve had Covid are allowed to participate but only if they bring a negative test. Unvaccinated aren’t allowed at all. So… why not? Is a negative test from an unvaccinated person less worth than that of someone who’s had the shot? This is really getting ridiculous now. (And also just today a politician encouraged people to not interact with unvaccinated people anymore… You know, we’ve been at this point before in our history. I can’t shake my head enough at this country. I really can’t…) Its the logical extension of people wanting Zero Covid and using the unvaccinated as a scapegoat for something which will never happen |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 12, 2021 14:54:54 GMT
Perusing Reddit I came across a post titled "Anti-Vaccine Doctor Who Called Mask Wearing Dangerous Dies of Covid-19". My first thought was "Damn, that show is taking a contentious direction these days" until I realised the end of the sentence made no sense, reparsed it and realised what it was actually trying to say.
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2,505 posts
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Post by zahidf on Nov 12, 2021 15:08:29 GMT
Some figuresÂ
"In the six months between October 2020 and March 2021, there were 3.8million recorded cases of Covid in the UK and 85,000 deaths. In the following six months, during which restrictions were reduced to nothing, there were 4.8million recorded cases and 14,000 deaths. Based on these figures, the case fatality rate fell from 2.2 per cent to 0.3 per cent. Since around half of all infections are not recorded, the infection fatality rate is now around 0.15 per cent, not much different to seasonal influenza. And remember that these statistics include a large number of deaths among the unvaccinated. For fully vaccinated people, the risk of dying if you catch Covid is lower still"
It's over in a broad sense in this country
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Post by hairspray57 on Nov 12, 2021 16:22:40 GMT
Second consecutive day of cases being up by several thousands week on week in England. Looks like another period of rising cases is happening.
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2,505 posts
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Post by zahidf on Nov 12, 2021 17:17:10 GMT
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Post by hairspray57 on Nov 12, 2021 17:29:59 GMT
And thousands might have died needlessly as a result. |
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Post by hairspray57 on Nov 12, 2021 17:30:47 GMT
When this was tried last year before the vaccine thousands probably died needlessly as a result. |
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2,505 posts
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Post by zahidf on Nov 12, 2021 20:08:42 GMT
When this was tried last year before the vaccine thousands probably died needlessly as a result. Isn't the same situation now with vaccine coverage though. |
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2,505 posts
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Post by zahidf on Nov 12, 2021 20:47:42 GMT
Never listen to Fake SAGE
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Post by interval99 on Nov 14, 2021 0:03:27 GMT
Judging from the pictures of tonight's festival of remembrance mask wearing indoors has been officially dropped.
Whatever status checks they may have done before going in, the seemly utter lack of anyone wearing a mask inside the packed hall will send a strong prompt that they are no longer needed and I expect the already low rates people report in theatres will plummet further now.
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311 posts
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Post by olliebean on Nov 14, 2021 9:25:41 GMT
Going by everything I have read and heard about it, in my opinion there has been a deliberate policy since a critical mass of people were vaccinated, not just to let the virus spread but to actively encourage it (without actually saying that's what they're doing) - the thinking being that the vaccine will protect most people against severe illness and death, and that vaccination followed by natural infection will ultimately result in a higher level of immunity than vaccination alone. The possibility that this will result in more resistant variants either hasn't been seriously considered by policy makers, or has been judged a risk worth taking. (Given the policy makers we have, I suspect the former.)
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258 posts
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Post by frankubelik on Nov 14, 2021 9:55:03 GMT
Felt the need to weigh in on the subject of "mandatory" mask wearing and in particular the sheer inconsistencies therein. ATG seem hell bent on insisting masks should be worn during both MOULIN & CABARET yet are content to sell seats offering food (Cabaret I gather) and tend to push the idea of having drinks at your seat during the performance. I attended PRIVATE LIVES at Richmond Theatre this week and despite the never ending email reminders of what to expect including status checks before entering (oh how I HATE have to queue) AND signs saying masks must be worn, from my seat in the third row stalls and observing the audience, I would say 95% were unmasked. So far my experiences have been very mixed; CINDERELLA - almost paranoid FOH staff (it was a last preview) pushing the audience into their seats especially at the interval which was largely ignored; SOUTH PACIFIC - no enforcement of any kind; FROZEN no checks conducted at door and likewise no mask enforcement; NIGHT MOTHER - 50% masked. The discomfort of being masked up for two hours plus (particularly wearing glasses which steam up!) detracts so much from any enjoyment even though I appreciate the measures taken. It's just incredibly frustrating.
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Post by hairspray57 on Nov 14, 2021 10:13:41 GMT
Going by everything I have read and heard about it, in my opinion there has been a deliberate policy since a critical mass of people were vaccinated, not just to let the virus spread but to actively encourage it (without actually saying that's what they're doing) - the thinking being that the vaccine will protect most people against severe illness and death, and that vaccination followed by natural infection will ultimately result in a higher level of immunity than vaccination alone. The possibility that this will result in more resistant variants either hasn't been seriously considered by policy makers, or has been judged a risk worth taking. (Given the policy makers we have, I suspect the former.) Plus there seems to 10% of so of double vaccinated people who are set tor refuse a booster jab. |
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2,505 posts
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Post by zahidf on Nov 14, 2021 16:27:18 GMT
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Post by hairspray57 on Nov 14, 2021 16:53:35 GMT
Will you say to the families of the victims who are still dying every single day. |
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5,161 posts
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Post by TallPaul on Nov 14, 2021 17:15:00 GMT
It's really not helpful to describe people who die of natural causes as "victims".
As a nation, we've painted ourselves into a corner with this 28 days definition. Viruses circulate in hospitals, and hospitals are full of ill people.
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Post by hairspray57 on Nov 14, 2021 17:44:56 GMT
It's really not helpful to describe people who die of natural causes as "victims". As a nation, we've painted ourselves into a corner with this 28 days definition. Viruses circulate in hospitals, and hospitals are full of ill people. Doesn’t mean they going to die during their admission through except for Covid. Tons of elderly People spend weeks in hospitals after falls but are otherwise in decent health. I’ve known more than one elderly person to be in and out of hospital semi regularly for a decade or more. Also unvaccinated health care staff are still working on wards with vulnerable patients - that should really have been stopped months ago let alone allowed to apparently carry on till the end of March. |
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2,505 posts
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Post by zahidf on Nov 14, 2021 18:27:38 GMT
Will you say to the families of the victims who are still dying every single day. Â Well no, but then it's better than being like China |
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Post by lynette on Nov 14, 2021 18:41:45 GMT
What is the Chinese vaccination programme?
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