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Post by Deleted on Aug 19, 2021 11:44:50 GMT
Fantastic to see so many positive reviews from the critics for this show - a refreshing change to some of the snidey comments from people desperate to see it fail. 100% this. It’s a lovely fun witty show with a big heart, some great songs and a fab design. Delighted to see it getting the recognition it deserves! And indeed, like Phantom, the snidey comments and desperation to see it fail can now disappear into obscurity…. |
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Post by Being Alive on Aug 19, 2021 11:50:13 GMT
Different opinions are a wonderful thing - lots of us arent desperate for it to fail, we jsut thought it was truly dreadful (and borderline offensive for me!)
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Post by karloscar on Aug 19, 2021 12:40:45 GMT
When the Guardian critic tells you that the lyrics are amazingly witty when they're pedestrian at best, and the tunes are fantastic when they're all ploddy and square and none of it fits the character it's supposedly written for, you begin to question their sanity. Are they so desperate for a hit they'll say absolutely anything?
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Post by Oliver on Aug 19, 2021 13:36:53 GMT
When the Guardian critic tells you that the lyrics are amazingly witty when they're pedestrian at best, and the tunes are fantastic when they're all ploddy and square and none of it fits the character it's supposedly written for, you begin to question their sanity. Are they so desperate for a hit they'll say absolutely anything? You're presenting opinion as fact and then accusing anyone who disagrees with your opinion is being irrational and insincere. Of course you are not alone in this. I don't agree with the review in the independent but I wouldn't say she's being either irrational or insincere. Why would the critics be "desperate for a hit"? That doesn't make much sense to me. I am mixed when it comes to David Zippel. It's interesting that you consider the best lyrics to be pedestrian, though, can you give examples of one or two of these? I couldn't disagree with you more about the music. |
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Post by fluxcapacitor on Aug 19, 2021 13:54:14 GMT
Fantastic to see so many positive reviews from the critics for this show - a refreshing change to some of the snidey comments from people desperate to see it fail. 100% this. It’s a lovely fun witty show with a big heart, some great songs and a fab design. Delighted to see it getting the recognition it deserves! And indeed, like Phantom, the snidey comments and desperation to see it fail can now disappear into obscurity…. With all due respect, I think it's unfair to assume all opinions which don't match up with yours about this show should be thrown in the same big pile just because a few reviewers paralleled your thoughts. I totally agree with you that there have been some snidey comments directed at Cinderella, and very possibly some people who - for whatever reasons - don't particularly want it to succeed. But a lot of the criticism has been fair, and people are entitled to a negative opinion. I personally really wanted this to be great, but I left the show feeling quite let down after struggling with it. I've posted my detailed thoughts previously, but it had nothing to do with snide or desperation for anything to fail. I just honestly didn't think, despite a few strong elements, that it was a very good show. In fact, the WOS review may have hit the nail on the head with this comment: For me, the good heart and sumptuous tunes weren't enough to forgive its (IMO many) failings. For Sarah Crompton (with this review) and others, I guess they are. And maybe that's the key to whether you enjoy this show or not. |
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Post by Being Alive on Aug 19, 2021 13:58:13 GMT
"but when you’re talking about the most famous composer of musical theatre in the world, plus a writer who just won an Oscar, I don’t think it’s unreasonable to expect something a bit more meticulous" THIS is exactly how I feel - whilst Time Out seemed to think it was more fun than I did, it's weirdly validating seeing a certified critic hit the nail on the head of exactly why I felt it should have been better than it was... (Full review here - www.timeout.com/london/theatre/cinderella-review-2 ) |
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Post by Oliver on Aug 19, 2021 14:37:09 GMT
"but when you’re talking about the most famous composer of musical theatre in the world, plus a writer who just won an Oscar, I don’t think it’s unreasonable to expect something a bit more meticulous" THIS is exactly how I feel - whilst Time Out seemed to think it was more fun than I did, it's weirdly validating seeing a certified critic hit the nail on the head of exactly why I felt it should have been better than it was... (Full review here - www.timeout.com/london/theatre/cinderella-review-2 ) I don't rate that particular reviewer at all, not because I disagree with him, but because he fails to show any musical insight and winds up being condescending towards something he hasn't given any real consideration to. Here he points to two songs that he considers "joyful" as best examples and has nothing to say about the score. His review is shallow. The fact that he rates "School of Rock" as one of ALW's best is very telling to me. The Independent provided a much better mixed review than this one. And while I'm not a fan of some of ALW's recent work, how can you just dismiss all of it as "self-important nonsense"? He totally lacks objectivity. |
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Post by scarpia on Aug 19, 2021 14:38:21 GMT
100% this. It’s a lovely fun witty show with a big heart, some great songs and a fab design. Delighted to see it getting the recognition it deserves! And indeed, like Phantom, the snidey comments and desperation to see it fail can now disappear into obscurity…. With all due respect, I think it's unfair to assume all opinions which don't match up with yours about this show should be thrown in the same big pile just because a few reviewers paralleled your thoughts. I totally agree with you that there have been some snidey comments directed at Cinderella, and very possibly some people who - for whatever reasons - don't particularly want it to succeed. But a lot of the criticism has been fair, and people are entitled to a negative opinion. I can't see that anyone on this thread or the Phantom thread wants to see either show fail. They want it to be the best it can be. Criticising it to say where each production disappoints and how it can be improved is not the same as 'desperation to see it fail'. Frankly, the OP's comment is childish. |
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Post by scarpia on Aug 19, 2021 14:43:46 GMT
I'm sceptical about this notion that critics will be more generous simply because theatre is making a return. A professional critic is not likely to allow that to influence their opinion of a show. The Guardian review was detailed and fully justified its five star rating by what was actually said. This is also true of other positive reviews. The difference with Quentin Letts' early review in previews is that he didn't justify his rating with a detailed critique - had all the other reviews been as cursory as his there might be a case, but no. The critics genuinely loved this. It depends on which of these are really critics. Quentin Letts is not really a theatre critic. Nor is the person the Guardie have used. Most professional critics have been replaced by journalists/columnists who don't have much of a cultural memory. And I mean this sincerely - I don't have a view on Cinderella either way as I'm holding off seeing it until later in the year. Nothing would please me more to find a show that is to my liking. That said, what I've seen/heard so far doesn't suggest that this is going to go on to attain classic status, as it will date within a decade. I have much more respect for, say, the 4* review for Cinderella in the Times. At least Clive Davis knows what he's talking about. Unlike, say, the entertainment reporter the Express got to do their Phantom review, who even stated the show was at the Prince Edward! |
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Post by caa on Aug 19, 2021 15:18:33 GMT
When the Guardian critic tells you that the lyrics are amazingly witty when they're pedestrian at best, and the tunes are fantastic when they're all ploddy and square and none of it fits the character it's supposedly written for, you begin to question their sanity. Are they so desperate for a hit they'll say absolutely anything? Must admit I have to say gone are the days when the Guardian critic's rave review meant it was a show worth seeing, except if Suzanna Clapp rates it! |
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Post by amuseical on Aug 19, 2021 15:54:36 GMT
"Frankly, the OP's comment is childish." Sorry - what does "OP" mean? Original Poster. |
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Post by BurlyBeaR on Aug 19, 2021 16:13:12 GMT
Posts removed. Please don’t discuss/criticise ex board members when they don’t have the power to respond.
Thank you.
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Post by AddisonMizner on Aug 19, 2021 16:21:16 GMT
More tickets now seem to be on sale for this up to May 2022.
Does anyone know if Carrie definitely has an alternate for this, and if so, is there a schedule of performances?
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Post by amuseical on Aug 19, 2021 16:31:57 GMT
More tickets now seem to be on sale for this up to May 2022. Does anyone know if Carrie definitely has an alternate for this, and if so, is there a schedule of performances? No schedule announced yet, but Georgina Onuorah is the alternate Cinderella. |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 19, 2021 16:42:44 GMT
100% this. It’s a lovely fun witty show with a big heart, some great songs and a fab design. Delighted to see it getting the recognition it deserves! And indeed, like Phantom, the snidey comments and desperation to see it fail can now disappear into obscurity…. I personally really wanted this to be great, but I left the show feeling quite let down after struggling with it. I've posted my detailed thoughts previously, but it had nothing to do with snide or desperation for anything to fail. I just honestly didn't think, despite a few strong elements, that it was a very good show. In fact, the WOS review may have hit the nail on the head with this comment: For me, the good heart and sumptuous tunes weren't enough to forgive its (IMO many) failings. For Sarah Crompton (with this review) and others, I guess they are. And maybe that's the key to whether you enjoy this show or not. Ahh apologies if I didn't express myself better. I absolutely agree with you and negative comments should most definitely not be thrown in the bin. I like it, but certainly many people won't and that's great. As someone who loves it, it's interesting to hear the reviews and reasons of those who don't! It is after all a discussion forum. The "snidey comments" element is fortunately small in number but it seemed, to my mind at least, that there were some who wanted this to fail. And some who post negativity without having seen it. Which I could live without. It seems to me, people who are historically exceptionally successful in musical theatre bear the brunt of this attitude. But I certainly didn't think of you as one of these people and appreciate reading your reviews. But yes, as someone who did like it, and would like it to do well, I was very happy to see some good reviews :-) |
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Post by lonlad on Aug 19, 2021 16:46:51 GMT
Yes, Carrie's alternate is named in the programme
Georgina Onuorah as the Ensemble/Alternate Cinderella
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Post by richey on Aug 19, 2021 17:47:38 GMT
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Post by Phantom of London on Aug 19, 2021 18:23:47 GMT
Michael Billington will be spinning in his retirement home. |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 19, 2021 18:26:08 GMT
I'm certainly surprised by those reviews. I know i went to the first preview, but considering they havent changed much, something must have happened between now and then to receive such high praise.
I'll have to go back and see for myself.
Maybe they're just easily pleased.
And yes that was sarcasm before someone piles on about different opinions etc.
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Post by mrbarnaby on Aug 19, 2021 19:51:56 GMT
Maybe the critics are in cahoots about not criticising a show of this scale in the current climate.
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Post by ceebee on Aug 19, 2021 21:35:01 GMT
Or maybe it's just a fun show that is right for the current climate. The usual suspects can be found in this thread and the Phantom thread carping about ALW and quality of shows. Yet the critics and many others disagree. That's life.
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Post by scarpia on Aug 19, 2021 21:56:08 GMT
Or maybe it's just a fun show that is right for the current climate. The usual suspects can be found in this thread and the Phantom thread carping about ALW and quality of shows. Yet the critics and many others disagree. That's life. Funny, I haven't seen anyone post in this thread who also has been critical of the for-the-21st-century-cheapened new-but-not-new Phantom. I have seen the 'usual suspects' who decided they would love both before they saw either try and shut down any debate over each show. |
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Post by sophie92 on Aug 19, 2021 21:59:10 GMT
Finally saw it tonight, from a moving seat (the best thing about it, let’s get that out the way quick).
It’s fine, it’s just not fantastic. There is a lot of promise and potential, but it’s not reached. For me there’s too many storylines going on within the main one, and as such there’s no time for them to really be explored. The cast are all doing a great job, and I really loved Georgina Castle and Laura Baldwin.
It’s not great when your main character is one of the least interesting characters, and is also extremely hard to root for.
I managed to get a cheap seat at the side of the moving section but unfortunately it felt like when they were staging the show, 75% of the time they forgot about the configuration of the auditorium. So much was blocked by cast. Given that these seats are going for £65 at most performances, and £105 at the weekend shows, that’s not brilliant. Our section also completely missed Cinderella’s entrance at the ball - though with the in-the-round configuration, there was never going to be a way for everyone to see this without clearing everyone else off the stage.
It did make for an enjoyable night at the theatre, I’m glad I’ve finally seen it and I will try and see Lauren Byrne as Cinderella. Just a bit frustrated that all the potential wasn’t reached, for me personally. 3 stars.
Edit just to add: before Act 1 began it seemed about 75% of the audience were not wearing masks, despite being asked to on the way in. This number only went up following the interval.
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Post by Steve on Aug 19, 2021 23:18:06 GMT
Saw this again tonight, this time from the moving seats, and LOVED it! Some spoilers follow. . . Sure, the multiple unwieldy plot threads do hinder the piece becoming a coherent "masterpiece" lol, but this is still, for me, one of the most entertaining shows in town, with banger after banger from Lloyd Webber, and a truly marvellous cast nailing each and every song. Yes, the origin, and even the fact (Cinderella never feels damaged enough to fall for the Godmother's trap, and the Godmother's character is given short shrift anyway), of Cinderella's fatal attraction to "beauty," is never explored, even though it is the lynchpin of the plot. But this show feels leagues ahead of the previews, for me, not because of any changes in the script, but because everything about the key love story, between Cinderella and Sebastian, has been perfected in the acting. Where once the actors delivered strong individual performances, now they deliver chemistry. Critically, Cinderella herself has been softened, with her initial absolute defiance and invincibility in previews now being leavened by humility. Where Victoria Hamilton Barritt once got big laughs when she refers to Cinderella "making a scene," now she gets none, because Cinderella is genuinely kowtowing to her, to keep her place in the household rather than railroading her. The show is stronger for that as this hint of vulnerability translates beautifully into flirting scenes between Sebastian and Cinderella that feel like the building blocks of love, rather than posturing banter. At it's core, for all the talk of groundbreaking storylines about identity, freedom and the oppression of enforced beauty standards, 90 percent of what we CARE about storywise is whether Cinderella and Sebastian are a cute couple, who complete each other, and who we enjoy rooting for. And tonight, I really really DID! By adding extra elements of heart and sensitivity into the mix, Carrie Hope Fletcher's more vulnerable Cinderella now matches Ivano Turco's always vulnerable Sebastian, and the nuances in all the moment to moment relating on stage between the two characters are vastly satisfying to watch, and form a critical backbone for all the wonderful variety-show-like entertainment provided by all the other characters and the hugely successful Lloyd Webber score. And to the extent that the show fails to explore the oppression of women in a meaningful way, the casting of Hope Fletcher goes some distance toward filling that void, as her fans already identify with her successful battles on stage (eg. Heathers) and probably in "real" life too (ie. YouTube) to puncture societal straitjackets and standards that hold women back. There is certainly enough in this show to make that young female fanbase very happy and sell a lot of tickets. I really hope this show does well and has a nice healthy run, despite these horrible pandemic times! And on an additional note, I did find the moving seats more enchanting and more like a magical Disney ride, than the mechanical gimmick I had assumed it was. I felt an immense uplift as our "rollercoaster carriage" glided into and among joyous dancing people! 4 and a half stars from me, revised upwards from the previews.  |
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Post by Jon on Aug 20, 2021 0:47:31 GMT
While I enjoyed the show when I saw it before its hiatus, I think it's a 3-3.5 star show than a 4-5 star show.
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