617 posts
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Post by loureviews on Jul 17, 2017 12:00:13 GMT
At work in meeting minutes unless you have an academic title (Dr/Prof) all women are listed as 'Ms'. As a married woman I find that bothers me. I'm Mrs!
However it does irk me when my mum addresses cards etc to 'Mrs [my husband's initial and surname]. I know that's convention unless you are a widow but not one I would ever follow myself.
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37 posts
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Post by Elisa on Jul 17, 2017 13:38:30 GMT
In my opinion, Miss ans Ms should be scrapped, and Mrs retained for all women regardless of their status. Doesn't it stand for Mistress after all? And I think it should actually be pronounced Mistress. I mean, if men are Mister, women should be Mistress. Then of course there are some non-binary people. But that's a different matter and it should be addressed to separately.
As an unmarried adult woman, I normally choose Ms, but only when I fill a form. I think that I'd probably laugh if somebody actually called me Ms (as I've been in Britain only twice, I never had a chance to be called anything).
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5,707 posts
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Post by lynette on Jul 17, 2017 15:43:21 GMT
Might be wrong but I think in France they call all women Madame and Mam'selle for girls..s'pose they judge age better in France. 😳
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37 posts
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Post by Elisa on Jul 17, 2017 16:16:53 GMT
I think they do. We do the same in Italy. "Signorina" (once for all unmarried women) is now only used for girls or teenagers, and usually only said by some older person that wants to be over polite (but it's been basically abolished in writing). "Signora" is used for all adult women.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 17, 2017 19:45:31 GMT
Goodness this thread has caused me to be told that even using first names is improper! I'm sorry I haven't been addressing you all as Lord and Lady all this time too...
Also that I have offensive world views. So sorry about that guys....
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Post by d'James on Jul 17, 2017 19:50:21 GMT
I prefer 'Your Highness,' @emicardiff!!! That suits for both genders too. ;-)
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Post by Deleted on Jul 17, 2017 19:54:35 GMT
I prefer 'Your Highness,' @emicardiff!!! That suits for both genders too. ;-) Well we ARE a bunch of Queens around here. Now now my peasants, bow. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 17, 2017 21:12:03 GMT
Well we ARE a bunch of Queens around here. Now now my peasants, bow. Maybe we should rename this board Henry VIII as it has more old queens than he had! I never got why they would use a man's initials when referring to his wife in print. Years back at Wimbledon when Chris Evert was married to John Lloyd she was shown on the scoreboard as Mrs J.T Lloyd not Mrs C.Lloyd - talk about old fashioned! But little miss cool Chris Evert has been through 3 sportsmen as husbands so she wasn't that innocent! In the olden days the Housekeeper was referred to as Mrs but a lot of the time she would likely have been a Miss unless she was widowed. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 17, 2017 21:18:40 GMT
The woman who brought the use of "Ms" into the mainstream died recently - interesting history of the word in her obituary: www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2017/jul/07/sheila-michaels-who-brought-ms-into-mainstream-dies-aged-78Regarding "Sir" - there's a way US authority figures / security guards / border control officers have of using it that makes it sound really demeaning to the person they are addressing. I imagine for instance the security people who dragged that Doctor off the plane were saying "Sir, you need to leave now". Ms used to be associated with the older spinster types who felt they were too old to be called "Miss" - the Dick Emery character Hettie springs to mind. In the Police/Military/Royalty a senior person is addressed as Sir or Ma'am but at school it was Sir or Miss, I never quite got that. Using the term Dr is a useful catch all especially when at the GPs. A few teachers at my school were Drs and used to be wound up when addressed as Doc or What's Up Doc. |
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4,029 posts
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Post by Dawnstar on Jul 18, 2017 12:53:08 GMT
Might be wrong but I think in France they call all women Madame and Mam'selle for girls..s'pose they judge age better in France. 😳 I'm dreading going back to France, as I fear that in the years since I last visited I have crossed the age from Mademoiselle to Madame! As someone who is unmarried & single I always ask to be addressed as Miss when one has to pick an honorific, though I still get addressed as Ms frequently. I am not ashamed to be single so I am quite happy to use a word that shows I am single. |
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2,702 posts
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Post by viserys on Jul 18, 2017 12:56:15 GMT
Oh, I wouldn't worry about that. I love being addressed as Madame there, it conjures up a very rose-tinted image of myself as some sort of stylish Catherine Deneuve type. If only.
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Post by oxfordsimon on Jul 18, 2017 15:37:37 GMT
Miss/Mrs is completely pointless and offensive in this day and age. Never getting married anyway so Ms it will be, even if it does sound like you're doing a bee impression and half the time people mishear and write down Miss anyway. Sigh. I cannot see why anyone choosing to use Miss or Mrs could be deemed offensive in the slightest if that is how they wish to be known. If we are in a culture where we are asking how people wish to be called, then people are within their rights to choose Miss or Mrs without others deeming it to be offensive. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 18, 2017 16:15:18 GMT
Miss/Mrs is completely pointless and offensive in this day and age. Never getting married anyway so Ms it will be, even if it does sound like you're doing a bee impression and half the time people mishear and write down Miss anyway. Sigh. I cannot see why anyone choosing to use Miss or Mrs could be deemed offensive in the slightest if that is how they wish to be known. If we are in a culture where we are asking how people wish to be called, then people are within their rights to choose Miss or Mrs without others deeming it to be offensive. Firstly, I'm not saying it's offensive when people call themselves Miss or Mrs, I'm saying it's offensive that in 2017 women are still given options based on their marital status and men are not. Either give men more options, or take the ones from women away. But it should be the same for both. Secondly, choice feminism (ie. feminism based on the idea that women can choose to do whatever they like) is all well and good but the choices don't exist in a vacuum. Women choosing to use titles based on their marital status does effect other women who choose not to, as it effects the way women are seen in general in comparison to men. Similarly with things like changing their surname when getting married or even something like wearing makeup. I don't blame the individual women at all (I mean, I wear makeup), as we've all been brought up with these patriarchal traditions and pressures but that doesn't make the traditions/pressures not sexist or make the fact that they exist in the first place inoffensive. |
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4,156 posts
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Post by kathryn on Jul 18, 2017 17:55:58 GMT
At work in meeting minutes unless you have an academic title (Dr/Prof) all women are listed as 'Ms'. As a married woman I find that bothers me. I'm Mrs! However it does irk me when my mum addresses cards etc to 'Mrs [my husband's initial and surname]. I know that's convention unless you are a widow but not one I would ever follow myself. At my work the convention is 'first name, surname' for everyone - no titles at all. Some people don't change their name at work when they get married at all - they just find it easier to stick with their original name, rather than change it and confuse people. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 18, 2017 18:28:24 GMT
Either give men more options That's something I've often pondered, snutte. Could men be allowed a "married" designator? But what would it be? I would think Mr would be kept as the married designator as I feel like it's associated with an older man. For the unmarried, hopefully something that sounds more pleasant than Ms! |
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37 posts
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Post by Elisa on Jul 18, 2017 18:32:07 GMT
If we had to follow the same convention as Miss/Mrs/Ms, men should have something like Mt (pr. Mist), Mr and... something along the lines of Md (pr. mid or mud?).
I'd rather prefer having one title only for women, though.
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5,707 posts
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Post by lynette on Jul 18, 2017 19:16:36 GMT
Looking
A prospect
A keeper
Too attached to his mother
Appropriately abbreviated e.g. L, P, K, Tatm
It's been v hot today
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4,156 posts
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Post by kathryn on Jul 18, 2017 20:10:14 GMT
Looking A prospect A keeper Too attached to his mother Appropriately abbreviated e.g. L, P, K, Tatm It's been v hot today How about 'Av.' for 'Available'? |
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19,787 posts
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Post by BurlyBeaR on Jul 18, 2017 20:23:46 GMT
Or B.O.D for 'Back off Darling'.
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