One Love Manchester

Perhaps

In order to reflect modern society at large

A big fat blob would be more representative?



At the age of 23 she has found herself under remarkable pressure

And she commands more respect from young people

Than any MP or PM will ever manage

Not long in from London and spent the train ride home reading a twitter timeline FULL of tweets about this - it sounds like the perfect response to the horrors in both Manchester and London. Just now starting to watch on iPlayer...

So she's either 'doing something amazing for someone who's only 23!' or 'she's an adult' (I tend to side with the latter, by the way. She's perfectly old enough to have a poised response to a horrendous event where - one assumes - she herself was never really in any danger. Check out the poised responses of real children in countries where they see their families killed and injured in attacks like these, and get back to me on the role model thing, yeah)?

Dressing in a revealing manner is a revolutionary act! Er, yes, I'm sure that's the response from most blokes who access her images. Sure, this is an image that Grande is not solely responsible for when it comes to influencing young women. I never said that. But she's in a position where, if she wanted to, she could buck that and show them there's an alternative. One night of wearing jeans and a jumper doesn't make the rest of it OK (and that's just my opinion, not a fact. It might be nice if others on here recognised sometimes that theirs is just an alternative opinion, not fact).

I didn't watch the comcert, no. I think it was a grotesque thing to hold, so soon after the event, that smacked a little of commercialism. If they'd wanted to do a small scale, intimate show, maybe that would have felt right. Or a show like this, a few months down the line. But hey ho, I see even the BBC are pushing the 'it was such a great response! Everyone's so happy!' line this morning. All those families still grieving quietly who think otherwise - let's just airbrush them out, because they're not responding the right way, huh?

I am glad some of you enjoyed the concert, believe me. It's just it wasn't for me, and I feel quite strongly about it. That's all.

Completely agree. It was a wonderful gesture to raise money quickly and to give people a bit of escapism. Many of the families affected went or supported the concert. Also it has been reported that Grande has donated a million dollars of her own money to the fund.

It was an uplifting and emotional event to bring people together and show that terrorism never wins. Grande and her team did well and as a Manc girl I thank everyone involved for it.

Correct, she wasn't in any danger. That's not the point.

A few weeks ago Manchester was just a stop in a tour. When someone killed a few people at her concert it was nothing to do with her. It just happened to be at her performance; it could have just have easily been someone else's event. She could have just moved on. But she didn't. She's put a hell of a lot of effort into supporting the injured survivors of the attack and led the way in bringing people together to show that neither Manchester nor the world is going to kowtow to murderers. She's done way more to help people get past this tragedy than anyone had any right to expect.

I'm struggling to see the wrong in this.

I honestly find your posts about this matter disturbing. Not everything has to be a comparison or competition. There is room to admire or sympathise with numerous people. I never said that people were uneducated about the issues you speak of, I said that the people involved in these issues do not have the worldwide impact that celebrities do have (like it or not!) and if celebrities decide to use their privilege and worldwide impact for good - when they do not have to - then they should be applauded for doing so, just like any other kindhearted human act should be applauded. There is something incredibly cynical about you seeing someone being praised (not paid or worshipped or knighted, just praised for a short while) for doing something good and having such an issue with it. You also clearly know little about Ariana for someone making such judgements if you describe her as someone with minimal talent. She is easily one of the most talented vocalists of her generation and it would be bizarre if someone with a voice like hers hadn't decided to pursue a career in music. Her career actually started on Broadway in musical theatre, something you have joined this website to talk about and appreciate with others. As you surely know, unknowns don't get their start on Broadway from having 'minimal talent and maximum glitz'. 

There is no such thing as an opinion that society holds. Society is full of people from all different background, cultures, experiences, religions, politics etc. I can't think of anyone that I know that would agree with you that women should be judged so harshly for what they wear. Men are responsible for their own responses, just as women are. Women may ogle a shirtless Justin Bieber and men may ogle Ariana Grande wearing a short skirt. As long as both the men and women recognize that there is a human being underneath all of that with feelings and thoughts, there is no issue. It is literally human nature to feel attraction to other humans. Yes we are living in a man's world, but in case you hadn't noticed, it's become much less of one as time has gone by and women have been liberated more and more and given more choices in how they express themselves. In Saudi Arabia women are required to cover themselves head to toe and women in their society suffer for it. You have offered no explanation of what the limits should be for how women should dress, because there are none in our society for good reason. I don't understand what the stereotype you refer to is - that adult women enjoy sex? That adult women enjoy feeling attractive? That's not a stereotype, that's just the truth for 99% of adult women (and men). There is absolutely nothing feminist about your opinion that women should present themselves in a certain way whilst men should present themselves as they please.

No one has made any suggestion that the families are in the wrong for not moving on fast enough or that anyone is grieving in the wrong way. There has simply been an opportunity for them to grieve in this way if they choose or an opportunity for them to not. It is not extremely difficult to turn off your phone and put on a DVD or read a book and avoid the concert, no. Ariana immediately acknowledged the attack via Twitter after it happened. She then set up a donations page. She then visited the injured in hospital. Nobody would have blamed her for not holding a benefit concert before continuing her tour, no. I imagine the reasoning for doing it so soon was 1. to be able to raise more money whilst it was fresh in people's minds, rather than 6 months down the line when many will have forgotten and not be so eager to donate and 2. as a way for Ariana to get comfortable with performing again, having her friends and boyfriend join her on stage, rather than being sent off on a world tour alone straight away. 

I had nothing but a passing knowledge of Ariana prior to the concert in Manchester (I wasn't even aware she was originally from kid's TV) I had utterly no perception of who she was other than 'young pop star whose music I'm not familiar with' what I saw last night was firstly a talented young pop star who seems able to sing a mix of styles (and sing brilliantly live) has great stage presence and overall is just a talented young woman. I enjoyed most of the songs she did and I'll actively listen out for her in future because irrespective of circumstance those were some damn good pop songs!

What I also saw was a poised, classy young woman who also cared deeply about what she was trying to do. I think she's handled herself with dignity throughout the whole thing- she hasn't made it all about her, she quietly went home and recovered for a few days then put together a charity concert (obviously with help) that raised what £5 million? I don't know what else anyone could expect.

I loved the concert, I thought the tone was right- a collection of really positive hopeful songs while still being conscious of why they were there.

As for the issue of 'too soon' or not, well that's an individual call. Many who were directly affected were there, and if it was too soon for people personally I don't think the concert existing was insulting to them. For me it was summed up when Ariana mentioned talking to one of the victim's Mum's and said she told her that her daughter would want 'the hits' and how that impacted their choice to put on an upbeat concert.

Also, Ariana and 'not wearing anything' is quite funny following a concert where she wore a sweatshirt and jeans the whole time....(but it's too early on a Monday for me to engage in what young women should or shouldn't wear debates)

I suggest you re-read my posts.

I wasn't fixated on her clothing at the concert. I didn't mention it until someone else did. I talked about her clothing in general, which I do not consider helpful to young women's body image (which can be considered a mental health issue).

I didn't say that because she was uninjured she was OK. I was merely pointing out that going on about how well she's doing may be unhelpful when damage to others, who may be coping in a much more private way, may be so much worse.

In fact, quite a lot of my posts have been about how I find the response to this concert an insult to others' psychological wellbeing. Please read more closely before firing off accusations.

What do eating disorders have to do with how people dress? Overweight people can dress skimpily and skinny people can dress in baggy clothes. If Ariana covered up everytime she left the house, her fans would still be aware that she is a thin girl. She has actually been criticised for being skinny and not being curvy. She has been told she does not have the ideal female body, because she has small boobs and isn't shapely. Her decision to take pride in her body regardless, rather than surgically alter it, is surely a good thing for young women to see. I know I could have used someone that I look upto wearing a jumper like this when I was a teenager and insecure about my own chest:

So every slim young woman who doesn't wear a sack is s bad role model? Even though Arianna Grande appears to be a perfectly healthy (and non-surgically altered) weight.
Edit: In fact I just googled her height and weight and stuck then into a BMI calculator, and according to those she is the ideal weight for her height. Obviously online stats need to be taken with a grain of salt, but she is definitely not underweight in appearance.


You are sounding more and more like the Daily Mail. This looks like a knee-jerk dislike of the young woman that you are struggling to rationalise.