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Post by Deleted on May 7, 2017 11:45:39 GMT
Can we all agree Cats has the worst book ever? I mean I normally say every musical has a book, but this one could be the exception. Still it won the Tony award for Best Book. Also Aladdin's book is a bit simplistic and the dialogue could fit right into an episode of Eastenders.
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Post by hal9000 on May 10, 2017 1:28:03 GMT
I love Pygmalion.
And almost every song in My Fair Lady is a killer.
I have seen only 2 productions of MFL but I was counting the minutes. I am by far in the minority but I felt like the play said everything and the songs in the musical were like unnecessary padding.
It may not be the book, but it was... something.
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2,859 posts
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Post by couldileaveyou on May 10, 2017 8:04:52 GMT
I love Pygmalion. And almost every song in My Fair Lady is a killer. I have seen only 2 productions of MFL but I was counting the minutes. I am by far in the minority but I felt like the play said everything and the songs in the musical were like unnecessary padding. It may not be the book, but it was... something. YES It's not that MFL book is bad, but it's just Shaw's flawless play + songs, which makes it quite redundant. The only different thing is the finale, but they should have used the original since the musical's ending undermines the whole point.
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Post by Deleted on May 10, 2017 8:08:07 GMT
One of my favourite things about George Bernard Shaw is that he got so fed up of the public shipping Eliza and Higgins (they probably didn't call it shipping back then, but that's what it was) that he wrote a postscript that explicitly spells out that Eliza did marry Freddy and they did have a flower shop though it wasn't a rousing success and they did have to rely on the kindness of Colonel Pickering to help them somewhat.
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5,073 posts
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Post by Phantom of London on May 10, 2017 10:09:36 GMT
Can we all agree Cats has the worst book ever? I mean I normally say every musical has a book, but this one could be the exception. Still it won the Tony award for Best Book. Also Aladdin's book is a bit simplistic and the dialogue could fit right into an episode of Eastenders. Wait: Did Cats actually have a book. Chess has never seemed to of worked.
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Post by Deleted on May 10, 2017 10:20:18 GMT
I still hold out hope that someone will sort out the unholy mess that is Chess because under it all there's a brilliant musical waiting to burst out (they've been workshopping again in NY apparently)
I mean I know Cats isn't supposed to make sense really but yes. Wasn't ALW talking about that on EP this Sunday? I only half listened but something about for him the book is key to a really successful musical and then laughed saying 'except for Cats obviously'
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Post by Deleted on May 10, 2017 10:43:19 GMT
Can we all agree Cats has the worst book ever? I mean I normally say every musical has a book, but this one could be the exception. Still it won the Tony award for Best Book. Also Aladdin's book is a bit simplistic and the dialogue could fit right into an episode of Eastenders. Wait: Did Cats actually have a book. Chess has never seemed to of worked. Apparently
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Post by Deleted on May 10, 2017 11:12:02 GMT
I still hold out hope that someone will sort out the unholy mess that is Chess because under it all there's a brilliant musical waiting to burst out (they've been workshopping again in NY apparently) Have they?! It's a collection of great songs in need of a book. Trouble is, most of the lyric is typical Rice brilliance - but doesn't really leave any space for an engaging story, as each song is more or less self-contained, I feel. They have, I think with no concrete aim (at least not in terms of planned performances) in mind. One of those friend of a friend is involved situations...
I love Chess dearly in terms of the music, and I'd happily sit through it as is, but I know some people feel it's too much of a mess.
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Post by Phantom of London on May 10, 2017 17:08:53 GMT
Very strong rumours that Chess will be next years musical for ENO. I would be happy to sit through that for the glorious music done with a full orchestra.
One day someone going to work this one out.
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Post by mallardo on May 10, 2017 17:12:11 GMT
Chess doesn't work because its premise doesn't work. The game of chess cannot be played as a cool sport - it's just not true. Freddy's line in One Night In Bangkok... "I get my kicks above the waistline, sunshine."... sums up the show's failure.
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Post by Deleted on May 10, 2017 17:27:23 GMT
Very strong rumours that Chess will be next years musical for ENO. I would be happy to sit through that for the glorious music done with a full orchestra. One day someone going to work this one out. Kerry Ellis for Svetlana!
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4,033 posts
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Post by Dawnstar on May 10, 2017 17:43:42 GMT
One of my favourite things about George Bernard Shaw is that he got so fed up of the public shipping Eliza and Higgins (they probably didn't call it shipping back then, but that's what it was) that he wrote a postscript that explicitly spells out that Eliza did marry Freddy and they did have a flower shop though it wasn't a rousing success and they did have to rely on the kindness of Colonel Pickering to help them somewhat. A postscript that evidently was not read by the director who did a production at my local theatre a few years ago that ended with Eliza & Higgins locked in each other's arms. The actress playing Eliza said to me afterwards that Shaw would have been turning in his grave! Personally, having seen multiple productions of both Pygmalion & My Fair Lady, I do prefer the latter for the added scenes. When I see Pygmalion I feel there are bits missing! Chess doesn't work because its premise doesn't work. The game of chess cannot be played as a cool sport - it's just not true. Freddy's line in One Night In Bangkok... "I get my kicks above the waistline, sunshine."... sums up the show's failure. I really like that line. Guess it's just me who does then!
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Post by Deleted on May 10, 2017 17:59:33 GMT
Chess doesn't work because its premise doesn't work. The game of chess cannot be played as a cool sport - it's just not true. Freddy's line in One Night In Bangkok... "I get my kicks above the waistline, sunshine."... sums up the show's failure. Hey ALL the cool kids play chess I'll have you know.... Which probably explains why the sum total of my knowledge comes from the musical. Anyway, I adore the music in it, I cling to the belief that it's got something in it (and as long as that somethig is never ever Marti Pellow again I'm good with that)
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Post by Deleted on May 10, 2017 18:27:07 GMT
Perhaps it's just me, but I saw the Aberystwyth Arts Centre annual summer musical production of Chess and I just couldn't make head or tail of anything.
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Post by Deleted on May 10, 2017 18:29:42 GMT
Perhaps it's just me, but I saw the Aberystwyth Arts Centre annual summer musical production of Chess and I just couldn't make head or tail of anything. It's not just you. That is the general consensus on it- that it's just a mess. Which it is. But I love it still.
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Post by Deleted on May 10, 2017 18:40:05 GMT
Just to carry on boring you all to death as usual, my other Chess story is that, an hour or two before a preview of the original West End premiere production of Chess, I bought a prime stalls ticket from the box office, in person. As I walked away, I glanced at the ticket to check the details and saw, printed on it, "Gala Charity Performance - Black Tie". As I was wearing a casual short-sleeved shirt and jeans, and had been told none of these details on buying the ticket, I went straight back to the window to ask whether I'd be let in. After giving me a dirty "You are a troublemaker" look, the clerk disappeared to ask his supervisor. He returned and asked me where I was sitting. When I said Stalls, he said I was in luck because Princess Margaret was seated in the dress circle and I wouldn't have been allowed in there in my clothes. Actually, it turned out to feel very uncomfortable seeing it mid-Stalls because virtually everyone else was in Black Tie evening dress, and I sensed a general feeling that I'd dressed this way as some especially planned class protest. This occasion was one of my very first West End theatre experiences!
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Post by Deleted on May 10, 2017 18:41:47 GMT
@honouredguest
I love that story!
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5,073 posts
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Post by Phantom of London on May 10, 2017 19:36:59 GMT
Just to carry on boring you all to death as usual, my other Chess story is that, an hour or two before a preview of the original West End premiere production of Chess, I bought a prime stalls ticket from the box office, in person. As I walked away, I glanced at the ticket to check the details and saw, printed on it, "Gala Charity Performance - Black Tie". As I was wearing a casual short-sleeved shirt and jeans, and had been told none of these details on buying the ticket, I went straight back to the window to ask whether I'd be let in. After giving me a dirty "You are a troublemaker" look, the clerk disappeared to ask his supervisor. He returned and asked me where I was sitting. When I said Stalls, he said I was in luck because Princess Margaret was seated in the dress circle and I wouldn't have been allowed in there in my clothes. Actually, it turned out to feel very uncomfortable seeing it mid-Stalls because virtually everyone else was in Black Tie evening dress, and I sensed a general feeling that I'd dressed this way as some especially planned class protest. This occasion was one of my very first West End theatre experiences! Surely for his musical you would have equally the same amount of people in a white tie. As nice as your story comes across, but I am not having it that a princess was there, if you said a King or Queen I would have believed you. 😜😜😜😜😜
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Post by Deleted on May 11, 2017 7:41:49 GMT
Just to carry on boring you all to death as usual, my other Chess story is that, an hour or two before a preview of the original West End premiere production of Chess, I bought a prime stalls ticket from the box office, in person. As I walked away, I glanced at the ticket to check the details and saw, printed on it, "Gala Charity Performance - Black Tie". As I was wearing a casual short-sleeved shirt and jeans, and had been told none of these details on buying the ticket, I went straight back to the window to ask whether I'd be let in. After giving me a dirty "You are a troublemaker" look, the clerk disappeared to ask his supervisor. He returned and asked me where I was sitting. When I said Stalls, he said I was in luck because Princess Margaret was seated in the dress circle and I wouldn't have been allowed in there in my clothes. Actually, it turned out to feel very uncomfortable seeing it mid-Stalls because virtually everyone else was in Black Tie evening dress, and I sensed a general feeling that I'd dressed this way as some especially planned class protest. This occasion was one of my very first West End theatre experiences! Surely for his musical you would have equally the same amount of people in a white tie. As nice as your story comes across, but I am not having it that a princess was there, if you said a King or Queen I would have believed you. 😜😜😜😜😜 Who are you calling Princess
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Post by Deleted on Nov 6, 2017 19:02:44 GMT
What does everyone think of the notion that book writers get none of the credit when a show is a hit and most (if not all) of the blame when it's a flop?
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Post by Deleted on Nov 6, 2017 19:07:09 GMT
What does everyone think of the notion that book writers get none of the credit when a show is a hit and most (if not all) of the blame when it's a flop? For how many Sondheim musicals has the bookwriter ever been given anything like equal credit?
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Post by Deleted on Nov 6, 2017 19:09:52 GMT
What does everyone think of the notion that book writers get none of the credit when a show is a hit and most (if not all) of the blame when it's a flop? For how many Sondheim musicals has the bookwriter ever been given anything like equal credit? Not many I think Same for ALW and virtually any show. Except when it's based on a movie and the screenwriter also does the book for the musical.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 6, 2017 19:41:37 GMT
What does everyone think of the notion that book writers get none of the credit when a show is a hit and most (if not all) of the blame when it's a flop? It’s because people have a misguided belief that they could do it easily. Stringing a few words together as dialogue? No problem. Writing lyrics with a rhyming structure that works in real time? Ooh, a bit trickier. Writing music? Most people would pass on that one. For schools, mostly, I’ve done all three and I found them to be the opposite in difficulty. Music you either can or can’t, lyrics are something I sweat over, it’s rewarding but an effort, but bookwriting? Months of research, planning, structuring yet the ‘flashier’ songwriting role gets all the praise.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 6, 2017 23:25:11 GMT
What does everyone think of the notion that book writers get none of the credit when a show is a hit and most (if not all) of the blame when it's a flop? It’s because people have a misguided belief that they could do it easily. Stringing a few words together as dialogue? No problem. Writing lyrics with a rhyming structure that works in real time? Ooh, a bit trickier. Writing music? Most people would pass on that one. For schools, mostly, I’ve done all three and I found them to be the opposite in difficulty. Music you either can or can’t, lyrics are something I sweat over, it’s rewarding but an effort, but bookwriting? Months of research, planning, structuring yet the ‘flashier’ songwriting role gets all the praise. Yeah, that's so true. I spend months outlining the story and writing the scenes and then a composer swoops in and writes the score in a few weeks and takes most of the credit.
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Post by profquatermass on Nov 7, 2017 16:35:03 GMT
Mack and Mabel has a terrific score but a hopeless book that just doesn't make sense however many rewrites get done
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