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Post by couldileaveyou on Oct 27, 2016 20:27:14 GMT
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2,339 posts
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Post by theglenbucklaird on Oct 27, 2016 20:46:23 GMT
Just checking my tickets to ensure I have Red Barn on the list. Be right back
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4,211 posts
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Post by anthony40 on Oct 27, 2016 21:01:14 GMT
To me nudity, male or female, is not required (and I have felt this was for ever such a long tome now) unless it's absolutely essential to the plot.
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Post by sondheimhats on Oct 27, 2016 21:15:01 GMT
Interesting to read her perspective on this. In my experiences seeing theatre mostly in New York (and London only recently), I feel like I've seen a fairly equal amount of male nudity vs. female nudity, with male nudity being perhaps slightly more frequent. And I feel like the male nudity I've seen has often been just as -- if not more -- gratuitous than the female nudity. I totally get where she's coming from though. I think she rightly points out that there's a different culture around female nudity than male nudity.
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19,780 posts
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Post by BurlyBeaR on Oct 27, 2016 21:41:06 GMT
I'm somewhat trepidatious about seeing Hair at the Hope Mill next month. It is a very small space!
More generally, I have no more desire to see a woman's breasts and genitals than I have to see some actors flaccid and unattractive penis. Put it away dear.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 27, 2016 22:33:23 GMT
I for one love a good bit of nudity, male or female, it can liven up the dullest evening. It's the only chance I get at seeing naked women, they have such beautiful bodies.
I went to a whole season of theatre at the Marlborough (queer venue in Brighton) and EVERY show had a lesbian get naked in it. I got to see all manner of differently attired vaginas, it was very educational. My favourite was the one where she stood in a washing up bowl and cleaned her majestic garden
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19,780 posts
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Post by BurlyBeaR on Oct 27, 2016 22:43:16 GMT
I for one love a good bit of nudity, male or female, it can liven up the dullest evening. Read a book.
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183 posts
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Post by bee on Oct 28, 2016 6:01:10 GMT
I must be going to the wrong shows because I'm pretty sure that I've seen way more male than female nudity over the years. At the theatre anyway. Worst example I can remember was The Judas Kiss where one of the actors spent ages on stage with his meat and two veg flopping about. He wasn't even that necessary to the play, I don't think he had a line to deliver (I'm trying to resist the temptation to say he only had a small part). It seemed completely gratuitous.
I can't remember ever seeing a nude scene (male or female) where it seemed especially necessary.
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2,702 posts
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Post by viserys on Oct 28, 2016 6:15:28 GMT
I think it's a much bigger problem in movies and on television where female nudity is so often a cheap ploy to attract viewers.
On stage it seems to be much more balanced, so I find female nudity as such less of a problem. Whether it's necessary or not - I'd say in 90% of the cases it could be done without. Directors may still think it's "edgy" or "radical" and the odd actor or actress may find it a brave challenge or a chance to do something new. Who doesn't remember all the brouhaha about "Harry's Wand" when Daniel Radcliffe moved from the clean-cut family movie franchise of Harry Potter to do Equus on stage? I do think however, that only female actresses suffer from the "come gawp at her sexyness on stage" angle. Nobody would have called Radcliffe "pure theatrical viagra" or whatever the obnoxious phrase for Nicole Kidman was.
But overall - yea, I can do without nudity on stage or on screen unless there is a very very good reason for it. Put it away.
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Post by couldileaveyou on Oct 28, 2016 6:59:18 GMT
I must be going to the wrong shows because I'm pretty sure that I've seen way more male than female nudity over the years. Yes, absolutely, that's what I thought reading the article. I think 90% of nudity I've seen onstage is male. And, as somebody else said, I think it's more tv/movies to show off naked women for no reason at all.
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Post by Jan on Oct 28, 2016 7:18:27 GMT
I absolutely deplore the objectification of women and the likes of the Sun Page 3 but I am very keen on female nudity on stage, but only when it's in a pseudo-intellectual play so I can view it with a detached superior expression on my face as if it's nothing special. Over the years Terry Johnson has supplied my particular requirements with the likes of Hitchcock Blonde but Tom Stoppard and Peter Shaffer have also obliged. I have high hopes for Red Barn.
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Post by Anniek on Oct 28, 2016 7:31:03 GMT
But when is it absolutely necessary? I don't mind a bit of nudity really. As long as it's done in a proper way. I,for example hate striptease-shows and magic mike-kinda entertainment, but the nudity in Mrs Henderson, I thought was really nicely done. Also the bed scene in Love Story was done clever. (Not sure if that's the same everywhere, but in NL Jenny was topless, but her hair (It's was Celinde Schoenmaker) was covering most of her breasts anyway.
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Post by Mr Snow on Oct 28, 2016 7:32:05 GMT
I'm somewhat trepidatious about seeing Hair at the Hope Mill next month. It is a very small space! Danny Baker includes an anecdote in his first autobiography about his sister taking him up west for the first time to see Hair. Sitting in an aisle seat in the stalls the young Mr Baker was a little perturbed when the cast disrobed, came down from the stage to sing and dance. When a male actor stood next to him, he stared straight ahead not knowing where to look! So he can’t be sure but something touched his cheek as the actor span round! Hope you enjoy the show! (Like most of Danny’s stories best not thought about too much).
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Post by Deleted on Oct 28, 2016 8:10:37 GMT
The only show I have seen with nudity is Mrs Henderson Presents and that is ecause it is essential to the plot. However, it is tastefully done using special lighting to just shine on the faces and there is nothing wrong with it. We went as a family and it was all fine, certainly wasn't the worst thing about the show
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Post by londonmzfitz on Oct 28, 2016 8:22:18 GMT
Patricia Clarkson in the Elephant Man which was nicely done and appropriate, I thought.
However the recent Dr Faustus I felt the nudity was used to shock - not as shocking as what followed in terms of rape, sh*t munching, etc ...
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Post by Deleted on Oct 28, 2016 8:25:00 GMT
Glad to see the original post is being treated with appropriate light-heartedness, politeness and consideration over here. Same can't be said for everywhere...
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1,103 posts
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Post by mallardo on Oct 28, 2016 8:48:16 GMT
The most graphic nudity I have seen on stage was in Cleansed at the NT. Can we say it was inappropriate or in any way gratuitous? I don't think so.
I also don't think the nudity in Dr. Faustus was out of place or meant simply to shock. It was part Jamie Lloyd's mis-en-scene for the piece and fit right in with the rest of the show.
The days are long gone when there was any kind of social or professional stigma attached to an actress/actor doing nude scenes. The whole attitude to the article seems to be retrogressive and passé.
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Post by Jan on Oct 28, 2016 8:49:02 GMT
The only show I have seen with nudity is Mrs Henderson Presents and that is ecause it is essential to the plot. However, it is tastefully done using special lighting to just shine on the faces and there is nothing wrong with it. We went as a family and it was all fine, certainly wasn't the worst thing about the show Yeah it was essential, but the WHOLE POINT of the show itself was to get nudity on stage in my view, it follows a long line of similar shows which very knowingly use nudity (or the prospect of it) to attract a mainstream theatre audience - Equus, Steaming, Calendar Girls, The Graduate, etc. etc. etc.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 28, 2016 8:59:20 GMT
The only show I have seen with nudity is Mrs Henderson Presents and that is ecause it is essential to the plot. However, it is tastefully done using special lighting to just shine on the faces and there is nothing wrong with it. We went as a family and it was all fine, certainly wasn't the worst thing about the show Yeah it was essential, but the WHOLE POINT of the show itself was to get nudity on stage in my view, it follows a long line of similar shows which very knowingly use nudity (or the prospect of it) to attract a mainstream theatre audience - Equus, Steaming, Calendar Girls, The Graduate, etc. etc. etc. But the whole story of Mrs Henderson is about the true story of the theatre which put in naked woman in the war? The whole show wasn't filled with naked women, it was that one scene before the interval. Also for Calendar Girls, don't they hide behind objects for the Calendar? Again, if you go and see Calendar Girls you are expecting there to be nudity as the WHOLE show revolves around the girls who made a naked calendar for charity
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Post by Jan on Oct 28, 2016 9:03:55 GMT
Yeah it was essential, but the WHOLE POINT of the show itself was to get nudity on stage in my view, it follows a long line of similar shows which very knowingly use nudity (or the prospect of it) to attract a mainstream theatre audience - Equus, Steaming, Calendar Girls, The Graduate, etc. etc. etc. But the whole story of Mrs Henderson is about the true story of the theatre which put in naked woman in the war? The whole show wasn't filled with naked women, it was that one scene before the interval. Also for Calendar Girls, don't they hide behind objects for the Calendar? Again, if you go and see Calendar Girls you are expecting there to be nudity as the WHOLE show revolves around the girls who made a naked calendar for charity My point is that sometimes it is the show itself which is gratuitous, not the nudity in it.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 28, 2016 9:13:32 GMT
My point is that sometimes it is the show itself which is gratuitous, not the nudity in it. Ha! Yes! If every show were required to be essential, then the theatres would all be permanently shut (with the possible exception of the Globe Theatre until April 2018).
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Post by Mr Crummles on Oct 28, 2016 10:00:01 GMT
I don't remember ever seeing a play where nudity seemed gratuitous to me. It has never been something that affected my appreciation of a production in any good or bad way. It usually seems natural to me.
I do, however, find that most sex scenes in films could be cut without making really any difference to the story. Most of the time they don't advance the plot, provides a psychological insight about the characters or show us something we didn't know about them, or add any dramatic information. It's not that I dislike these scenes, I just find them dramatically useless. But still, I'd much rather have the gratuitous sex than the violence.
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Post by Jan on Oct 28, 2016 10:29:03 GMT
My point is that sometimes it is the show itself which is gratuitous, not the nudity in it. Ha! Yes! If every show were required to be essential, then the theatres would all be permanently shut (with the possible exception of the Globe Theatre until April 2018). Years ago there was a Paul Verhoven film called Showgirls which attracted a lot of negative press particularly from women's groups. You are saying that because the nudity in that film was essential to the plot, because the film was about strippers, then that's just fine and no-one should complain. It's a view but not mine. BTW on the Globe you need to forget it and move on, it's over and she's going.
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Post by DuchessConstance on Oct 28, 2016 10:34:46 GMT
It's really not anything to do with stigma, it's to do with the fact there is enormous pressure on actresses to do nudity. For all that some individuals claim nudity is empowering, being forced to take your clothes off in front of total strangers, your friends and family, your colleagues, etc. can be extremely uncomfortable and even traumatic. Yet many actresses are put in the position of feeling nudity is simply something they have to do to have a career. In my experience there is far more gratuitous female nudity at the lower ends of the fringe scene (profit share pub fringe) and the ways directors and even agents pressure and force actresses to strip is really disgusting. There's one director who's infamous for having screaming abusive rants at his actors and he shoehorns female nudity into almost everything. Not paid, either.
In an industry that's already rife with exploitation and inappropriate (or no) boundaries, including sexual boundaries, the assumption that it's fine to demand that women strip on cue and that nudity is simply part of being an actor is highly problematic.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 28, 2016 10:37:30 GMT
I thought I was agreeing with you [replying to JB] that some shows (actually, most shows) aren't essential.
Paul Verhoeven is notorious for deploying sexual situations to arouse sectors of his audience. For example, the tone of Showgirls is generally schlocky but it also revels in a violently nasty rape.
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